Breaktru Forum

eCigarette Forum => Modding => Topic started by: mamu on December 21, 2013, 07:37:56 PM

Title: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 21, 2013, 07:37:56 PM
I know I know... crazy insane huh?   :laughing:

Got the NSR020A0X43Z (Naos Raptor 20A: Non-Isolated Power Module (http://www.geindustrial.com/publibrary/checkout/NSR020A0X?TNR=Data%20Sheets|NSR020A0X|generic)) in yesterday and just got it breadboarded.  So far, so good with testing. 

Initial testing was done with a 1.5 ohm dual coil carto.  I only have 32ga and 34 ga A1 Kanthal, so have ordered 28ga A1 Kanthal to do a sub-ohm (0.2 - 0.5) micro coil on my RBA to see how this module and the batteries handle the load.

I tested with the Sony 30A 18650 batts, but also have the Orbtronic 30A 18650 batts on order and will be testing with those too and I also want to test with the Samsung 30A 18650 batts, but haven't ordered them yet.

I added an external 18A fuse (2x 9A in parallel) and an external 7.5K pull-down resistor across the control on/off pin and ground and also an external zener diode on the control on/off pin for under voltage shutdown at 6V.  This module has a shutdown input voltage of 4.1, so adjusted that voltage cutoff to 6v with the zener diode. 

I set the output voltage range from 3.3V to 6V using a 220ohm resister and 200 ohm POT (same setup as is on the OKR module).

When I get done testing it, I will be putting it in my flip-top case for use with dual 18650 batts and also add a voltage reader for input/output voltage monitoring.

If anyone decides to use this module in a mod, I would highly recommend using the control on/off pin even though it adds a bit of a mA drain (similar to the OKR module).  Without it, voltage drop at higher output volts is significant.

(http://www.howder.com/raptor.jpg)

Update: will be adding 2x22uF MLCC input caps.  Thanks Craig!  :rockin smiley:


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on December 21, 2013, 08:26:27 PM
Great job and a very nice controller. I've seen that one before. As a matter fact I sent for a free sample a couple of years ago but never received it.

That's strange that not using the on/off pin would drop the output voltage. Anyway it's a good thing using it with the zener for cut-off. Well done mamu  :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 22, 2013, 12:25:27 AM
Worlds most powerful e cig lol.


Anxious for packaging,  thats a winner for the have to haves..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 22, 2013, 01:46:35 AM
That's a pretty cool module. 

I looked over that data sheet a bit.  Output is impressive.  It does need input capacitors.  It doesn't carry those onboard, look at page 12 of the data sheet;

Quote
An input capacitance must be placed directly adjacent to the input pin of the module, to minimize input ripple voltage and ensure module stability.

I actually have the same input capacitance requirement for the buck-boost converter I'm working on.  I'm using 2x22uF MLCC caps.  These (http://product.tdk.com/capacitor/mlcc/en/documents/C3225X5R1C226K250AA.pdf) are the best ones I've found, really nice characteristics. 

Data sheet says to leave the on/off pin floating if not using it so it shouldn't have any affect on output.  Maybe you should try tying that pin to Vin instead and see if that makes any difference.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 22, 2013, 03:11:19 AM
Great job and a very nice controller. I've seen that one before. As a matter fact I sent for a free sample a couple of years ago but never received it.

That's strange that not using the on/off pin would drop the output voltage. Anyway it's a good thing using it with the zener for cut-off. Well done mamu  :rockin smiley:

Thanks!

Yeah it is strange.  When I first set it up I did so without the control pin and ran it through various voltages.  Couldn't get loaded volts past 5.0v no matter what.  Hooked up the control pin and got max 5.9v loaded.  Nothing else changed but adding the control pin. 

That's a pretty cool module. 

I looked over that data sheet a bit.  Output is impressive.  It does need input capacitors.  It doesn't carry those onboard, look at page 12 of the data sheet;

I actually have the same input capacitance requirement for the buck-boost converter I'm working on.  I'm using 2x22uF MLCC caps.  These (http://product.tdk.com/capacitor/mlcc/en/documents/C3225X5R1C226K250AA.pdf) are the best ones I've found, really nice characteristics. 

Data sheet says to leave the on/off pin floating if not using it so it shouldn't have any affect on output.  Maybe you should try tying that pin to Vin instead and see if that makes any difference.

I was looking for a 20A module and with max 6v output and this appears to be the only one.  All others max at 5.5v.

Thanks for the clarification about the input cap.

I had ordered these caps and should get them Monday or Tuesday - http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GRM32CF51C226ZA12L/490-3392-1-ND/702933 (http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GRM32CF51C226ZA12L/490-3392-1-ND/702933) and http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GRM32ER61C476ME15L/490-3888-1-ND/965930 (http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GRM32ER61C476ME15L/490-3888-1-ND/965930).  But think I will order the ones you recommend and use them instead.

So - prob a n00b question here  :laughing: why 2x22uF caps and not one larger, say 47uF, cap?  I googled to find the answer but no luck.  Is it along the same lines as paralleling 2 fuses to lower the resistance?  Does paralleling 2 caps double the capacitance as it doubles the current in fuses?

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 22, 2013, 04:24:19 AM
There's several reasons you may want to parallel up caps.  I could easily write several pages on this, but I'll try to stick to the basic points.  It's mostly about ESR or equivalent series resistance.  A capacitor has resistance as well as capacitance and this resistance can have negative effects for the function a capacitor performs.  To skip any tedious explanations, less ESR is better.

Much like resistors in parallel reduces resistance, capacitors in parallel reduces ESR.  This is a desired thing for most capacitor applications.  Not always though.  For example, some linear regulators have specific ESR requirements to achieve stability.  Though, those types of linear regulators are being phased out for ones that can use MLCC caps.  MLCC caps are becoming the standard capacitor any more.  They just have huge advantages over other types of caps, but they have their issues too.

As MLCC caps are becoming the defacto cap, they have certain disadvantages that can be an issue in design.  A characteristic called DC bias can in effect neutralize the capacitor if voltage applications are too high.  By using capacitors in parallel, more component area can be dedicated to reducing the effect of DC bias.

Finally, inductance is something capacitors also carry along with them.  It's properly known as ESL or equivalent series inductance.  It's the opposite of capacitance so it's like capacitor poison, they cancel.   Inductance can also create ugly voltage spikes causing electrical noise which can degrade the reliability of sensitive digital components.  Paralleling capacitors reduces inductance much like paralleling resistors reduces resistance.

Well, I tried to keep that short and sweet, hopefully that helps.  I left so much out, but any more would be way too tedious to write and to read.

Oh, one thing I thought of after after I made that last post is the stability dependence on the input caps.  I bet the voltage issues you're seeing will go away once you add those.  Converters exhibit strange behavior when they have stability issues.  Believe me, I've seen them do some really bizarre things when tuning them on the bench.  Sometimes there's just no rhyme or reason to it.  Just getting your hand close to the board can cause them to go in and out of stability when they're right on the edge.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on December 22, 2013, 06:29:42 AM
Very good Craig. That was informative with out losing me  :laughing:

Now I know why some schematics use parallel caps. I always wondered why they draw a single cap symbol but reference 2x##uf
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 22, 2013, 07:52:05 AM
LOL - me too breaktru.

Great info to know!! Thanks so much Craig!! 

You didn't mention if the value changes when paralleling caps, so I assume it doesn't change.  Paralleling caps decreases ESR and also ESL, but does not change the caps value - 2x 22uF or 4x 22uF is still 22uF, correct?

 :thankyou:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on December 22, 2013, 08:13:51 AM

I added an external 18A fuse (2x 9A in parallel)


Looking at the datasheet, you may want to rethink the fuse rating

From Page 3, Table 1:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 22, 2013, 08:40:12 AM
The datasheet says that those fuse values listed in Table 1 are suggested maximum fuse ratings and for "optimum circuit protection, the fuse value should not be any larger than required in the end application."

I don't think 18A limit would be a problem, but I chose that value so not to max out the 20A of the module plus I can't imagine anyone vaping even near an 18A load.  Maybe my thinking is off, not sure.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on December 22, 2013, 09:09:25 AM
Right mamu. You are correct "required in the end application". Doh
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: kortt on December 22, 2013, 01:05:06 PM
That's going to be a monster, thanks for sharing Mamu. :)

Looks like this is going to be one of those great 'learning" threads for those of us trying to wrap our heads around this stuff.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 22, 2013, 01:16:35 PM
Great info to know!! Thanks so much Craig!! 

You didn't mention if the value changes when paralleling caps, so I assume it doesn't change.  Paralleling caps decreases ESR and also ESL, but does not change the caps value - 2x 22uF or 4x 22uF is still 22uF, correct?

 :thankyou:

You're welcome guys, I enjoy discussing the rhetoric.

Yes, you deal with capacitance of series and parallel parts opposite of resistance.  For capacitors, it adds in parallel and subracts in series.  This is opposite of inductors and resistors that add in series and subrtract in parallel.  The inducatance one is weird.  It took me a long time to wrap my mind around how inductors in parallel subract.

For setting up capacitor arrays, you determine the capacitance requirement then divide by the number of caps to determine the required value of each cap.  For the specific case in the module we're discussing, they are recommending a capacitance of 44uF (2x22uF) or 88uF (4x22uF) depending on the desired reduction of input ripple. 

For our purposes space is a premium so the 44uF array would be ideal.  However, input ripple can give you trouble and it's one of the disadvantages of this type of regulator.  If you plan to run an MCU on the same board, you need to take care that the noise created by heavy input ripple does not cause problems for the digital parts of the circuit.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 22, 2013, 04:19:40 PM
ok I got it now lol.

Paralleling caps decreases ESR and also ESL, and each individual cap's capacitance value is added.

This should be easy to remember then, it's the same as you taught us with fuses.  Paralleling fuses decreases resistance, and each individual fuse's current value is added.

And with inductors and resisters - it's the opposite when paralleling them as the values are subtracted.

And from what I'm understanding, one of the main reasons for paralleling caps and fuses to get the total value we need, instead of using one large value cap or fuse, is to decrease the resistance added to the circuit.

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain this, Craig!!  You make understanding electronics easy and you're a great teacher.  Absolutely awesome!! (http://www.mamumods.com/images/yourock.gif)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 23, 2013, 12:06:15 PM
Welcome,

Yes, that was something I wanted to mention before, arrays allow you to acquire higher capcitance values since MLCC caps don't go as high as other types.  There are issues with high value MLCC caps you can resolve by using several smaller ones, mainly the DC bias problem.  The benefit that comes with that is lower ESR and ESL.  Though the level of issues related to those two characterstics are frequency dependant so for lower frequencies it's less of a concern.  For the frequencies you see with a swithing regulator it can become an issue.  The modules people are using here and the ones I do myself typically switch around 500kHz where ESL and ESR start to become a considerable issue.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 23, 2013, 03:01:18 PM
Which meter is off or does it drop .2v?

The turnigy meter reads 5.7 the 1-6 meter  reads 5.9 hmm..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 26, 2013, 07:16:27 PM
Got the Raptor Flip-Top mod done!  manOman - awesome vape beast!

I'm vaping with it now with my dual coil 1.5 ohm RBA at 4.7v.  Sweet vape!    :thumbsup:

I had been vaping with it with a 0.8 ohm nano coil on an RDA at 3.5v and that was mighty sweet too!  But I hate dripping.  bleh.  But I loved the vape I was getting.  But I hate dripping.   :laughing:

Voltage drop under load so far is none or 0.1.  Awesome!!

During testing I attached a 0.3 ohm coil and ran it at 5v (83W and 17A) and both converter and batts (30A Sony 18650) handled the load aok - and no, didn't take a toke off that. 

Converter powers off when the input voltage gets down to 6.2v - so can adjust the zener diode to a slightly lower voltage, but I'm fine with a cutoff of 6.2v so will leave as is.  Metering the batts, the dominant batt read 2.75v and the other read 3.44v.  So to drain both batts more evenly, need to switch batt positions when the input voltage gets down to around 7 volts (I had forgot to do that - boo on me lol).

Getting ready to close er up...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor1.jpg)

Takes 2, 18650 batts... yes - the batts are in series   ;) - I wired the batt contacts so both batts are oriented the same way...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor2.jpg)

Displays input voltage...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor3.jpg)

Displays output voltage... range 3.3v - 6v (the tolerances of the resister plus POT I'm actually getting 3.39v - 6.1v with this build) ...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor4.jpg)

109mm x 58mm x 31mm...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor5a.jpg)

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor6.jpg)

Parts list:
SoShine dual channel 18650 charger (fasttech)

Naos Rapter (NSR020A0X43Z) 20A, 120W DC/DC Converter (digikey)

Fire switch (PV5S64011) (digikey)

2x22uF capacitors (C3225X5R1C226K250AA) (digikey) (I have those caps on order and plan to use them for future builds - thanks Craig! -  in this build I used GRM32CF51C226ZA12L)

2x9A fuses (650-RGEF900) (digikey)

200 ohm POT (PT10MH01-201A2020) (mouser)

220 ohm and 7.5K ohm resisters, and 5.6v zener diode (various sites)

Mini 3-position slide switch (on/off/on) (I used Apem TG39P000000)

1S-6S voltage reader (ebay)

2x 18650 batts (recommend 30A discharge rating)

Wiring guide... I used 20ga for input/output/voltage reader, 22ga for the mini slide switch and POT...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: kortt on December 26, 2013, 07:35:40 PM
Wow, what a beast!  .1v drop off?  wow, that's awesome.  Thanks for sharing the parts list and wiring guide.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on December 26, 2013, 08:23:17 PM
That is a mighty impressive build and the performance is stellar.
You picked the right batteries to feed that beast. Well done mamu.
Your write up and details are super as well. You know that your going to see several modders making this
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 26, 2013, 08:38:47 PM
Theres so many people misinformed of regulated vaping at ECF.
I made a post about this mod there I betcha they don't believe it is possible
or is a falsery like the mods who claim high power except the big names fail when tested..

A mech this a mech that, none of them can naos raptor   :wave:where's the argument?  Really? 
A regulated mod cannot vape a sub ohm coil, so many misinformed.
Regulated mods at this level with this much safety, feel so much safer vaping a sub ohm coil

Walkie talkie mod  that case

Loves it  @Mamu


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 26, 2013, 09:55:52 PM
Thanks guys!

LOL about the walkie-talkie mod - that's what some of my friends call my mods with this case.  And others call it my geek mod.   :laughing2:

I was thinking about writing one of my detailed step-by-step for this, then thought the better of it and just listed the parts and the wiring.  With this much power, I feel only experienced modders should be attempting this build.  Modders who are familiar with battery safety and electronics safety.  If someone can't figure out how to make this mod by just looking at the parts list and the wiring guide, then they aren't experienced modders and they shouldn't be building it.  I may be wrong, but this is how I feel about working with this particular converter. 

I built it for personal use and one of my sons has asked for one (he said he's going to steal mine when I go to bed lololol), so I'll be building one more.

And this does hit hard for the voltage.  I usually vape my 1.5 ohm dual coil RBA at around 5.1v and sometimes a little higher, but I get a comparable hit at 4.7v with this mod.  When I took that first hit dialed in at 5.1v, I almost choked.  holy moly I thought, so I dialed it down to where I get the same hit I'm used to.  Same with the 0.8 ohm nano coil RDA - I had to dial that down too. 

Of course, the 20ga wiring helps with current flow, or it may be the extra pixie dust I threw in  :laughing: I joke I joke, but it may just be the huge cushion of amps the converter provides or the efficiency it delivers the amps.  I'm only supposing here, but I'm really liking it a lot.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on December 27, 2013, 03:14:10 PM
 Great mod  :rockin smiley:
I was thinking of using a voltage display as a battery voltage check but wasn't sure how to wire it so thanks for the details.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 28, 2013, 03:14:56 AM
Looks like a good high output mod for running those super low resistance atties.  Don't understand why people are saying it's not possible to do that at ECF.  You can design things to do whatever you want, just a matter of selecting the right parts.  The problem comes from using the wrong parts, that's when it can be hazardous.

So did the input caps resolve that strange issue with the on/off pin and variations in voltage?

Totally OT here, but I just got back from visiting inlaws over Xmas in Los Angeles, stayed in Seal Beach.  Nice to get away from the cool temps here in Reno.  Have to mention, it really was beautiful at the beach, best weather ever, like summer almost.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 28, 2013, 08:28:13 AM
Great mod  :rockin smiley:
I was thinking of using a voltage display as a battery voltage check but wasn't sure how to wire it so thanks for the details.

TY and YW Mandro.

I used that same configuration for the input and output voltage reading with OKR Denali and Dena.  I fried a few OKR boards trying this and that until I finally got it right with using the on/off control of the converter and the 3-position on/off/on slide switch.  I hadn't wanted to use the on/off control. 

But that experience helped me with wiring this converter for input and output voltage display.

...So did the input caps resolve that strange issue with the on/off pin and variations in voltage?

I set it up and tested - with caps on Vin and without using the on/off pin, the max output voltage will only go to 5v.

With caps on Vin and with using the on/off pin, the max output voltage will go to 6v.

So this is the same results as not having caps on Vin.

What i did notice though, and this is both with and without caps, is that when not wiring in the on/off pin, when pressing the fire switch it gets very warm very fast - so a lot of current must be passing through it and I wonder if that would restrict output voltage.  With wiring in the on/off pin, the fire switch doesn't get warm at all so it's def taking the load off the switch. 

I was testing with a 1.5 ohm dual coil carto so it wasn't pulling more than 3-4 amps under load at the various voltages.  And i was using a 2A, 48VDC switch (PV5S64011)

The OKR doesn't restrict voltage when not using the on/off pin, and the fire switch doesn't get warm when not using the on/off pin, so this is really curious that this converter does that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 28, 2013, 01:31:47 PM
Looks like a good high output mod for running those super low resistance atties.  Don't understand why people are saying it's not possible to do that at ECF.  You can design things to do whatever you want, just a matter of selecting the right parts.  The problem comes from using the wrong parts, that's when it can be hazardous.

So did the input caps resolve that strange issue with the on/off pin and variations in voltage?

Totally OT here, but I just got back from visiting inlaws over Xmas in Los Angeles, stayed in Seal Beach.  Nice to get away from the cool temps here in Reno.  Have to mention, it really was beautiful at the beach, best weather ever, like summer almost.

Unaware of electronics you only need to watch a few videos of many mods on youtube and have  regulated mods all figured,  they do not fire below 1.2ohms and some do not fire below 1.5ohms,  oh yes they know all about regulated mods then.. 

Its 50 degrees here in Chicago last week we were at 10 below zero next week supposed to be in the cold cellar again.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 29, 2013, 03:04:58 PM
I’ve found 2 18650 batts that are aok with this mod.

Based on my testing, I would only recommend the Orbtronic SX30 18650 30A 2100mAh and the Sony 18650 US18650VTC3 30A 1600mAh.

Output varies between 0.0 and 0.1 voltage drop under load.  Input varies between 0.1 and 0.2 voltage drop under load with a cutoff of 6.2v unloaded and 6.0v loaded.

POS (piece of s**t don’t buy or use these lol) 18650 batts are the 30A Efest and 30A MNKE batts.  I highly doubt they are 30A as rated else the internal resistance is high.  Horrible horrible input/output voltage drop under load with a cutoff around 6.8v unloaded (drops to 6.0v loaded).

I did not test, or buy, the Samsung 30A 18650 batts cuz this batt needs a special charger, or a modded charger, that requires 4.35v to fully charge the batt.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 29, 2013, 04:13:42 PM
http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650comparator.php
use the pull down if not already familiar,

@ 20 amps the efest are not to shabby on test here. My test match identical with theirs from my seller..   No where near the sony's but marginally ok..

Make sure you do not have rebadged batts the efest are notorious for clones..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 29, 2013, 04:24:15 PM
The ultra-high drain Japanese 18650s are very good, even better than a LiPo for drain characteristics in some cases.  For example, the Sony US18650VTC3 has 12 mOhms internal impedance which is exceedingly low.  The 2200mAh hobby LiPos I have are about 5 mOhms and the 1000mAh ones are about 20 mOhms so that's pretty amazing. 

There's a number of cell models that charge to 4.35V.  I'm using the LG 18650 D1 in one of my mods and it's an incredibly well performing cell.  I use a 4.35V charger controller for it, the Microchip MCP73833-NVI specifically.  However, I have not seen that any of them are high drain.  The ones I'm using are 2C and I use two in parallel to get the drain high enough for my electronics.  The Samsung ICR18650-30B is another 4.35V cell that is also 2C.

In general, the higher voltage 2C cells are excellent performers with very nice looking discharge curves, however, they don't have particularly low internal resistance or particularly high drain limits.  The LG cells I'm using are about 60 mOhms and top out with a continuous drain of 6 Amps.

There's a some nice looking ultra-high drain Japanese cells besides the Sony one.  There's a the 2000mAh Samsung INR18650-30R and there's a new ultra-high drain cell from LG that came out.  It supposedly has 2500mAh and 12 mOhms internal resistance which blows all the rest out of the water.  I've only seen it once on a web listing and I'm not postiive on the details, but if that's correct, it's a pretty big jump in performance.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on December 30, 2013, 12:12:04 AM
...there's a new ultra-high drain cell from LG that came out.  It supposedly has 2500mAh and 12 mOhms internal resistance which blows all the rest out of the water.  I've only seen it once on a web listing and I'm not postiive on the details, but if that's correct, it's a pretty big jump in performance.

Thanks for mentioning that, Craig.

I've found em here: http://www.batterysupports.com/lg-lgdahe21865-36v-30a-high-drain-2500mah-lithium-ion-lion-p-158.html (http://www.batterysupports.com/lg-lgdahe21865-36v-30a-high-drain-2500mah-lithium-ion-lion-p-158.html)

and here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-LG-LGDAHE21865-HIGH-DRAIN-2500mAh-30A-3-6V-Lithium-ion-Li-on-18650-Battery-/321228740878?_trksid=p2054897.l4275#ht_8930wt_1051 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-LG-LGDAHE21865-HIGH-DRAIN-2500mAh-30A-3-6V-Lithium-ion-Li-on-18650-Battery-/321228740878?_trksid=p2054897.l4275#ht_8930wt_1051)

ordered a few to try out.

LG LGDAHE21865 HIGH DRAIN 2500mAh 30A Rechargeable Lithium Li-on 18650 Battery 

Description:
·  Li-ion 2500mAh 18650 cell
·  Product Name : LG LGDAHE21865 Lithium-ion Rechargeable Battery
·  Model : 18650
·  Norminal Capacity : 2500mAh
·  Diameter : 18.0mm
·  Height : 65.0mm
·  Weight(Typical) : 45g
·  Max. Continuing Charge Current : 30A
·   Internal resistance : 13mOhm
·  Charge Method: Constant Current and Constant Voltage(4.2V)
·  Nominal Voltage : 3.7 V
·  Discharge Temperature : -20°C ~ +60°C
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on December 30, 2013, 02:26:21 AM
Cool, will be interested to hear how they do on the bench.  Pretty hard to believe they can put out like the Sony cell and carry an additonal 900mAh, but LG generally doesn't exaggerate specs so they should perform as expected.  The 2C ones I have test out even a bit better than the ratings.  Data sheet says 70 mOhms, but it's more like 60 and they hit the 3000mAh rating at drain levels higher than 1/5C.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on December 30, 2013, 09:43:05 PM
Efest heard ya Mamu they just released a new 35a batt 18650 http://www.efestpower.com/Product/835619153.html
 :thumbsdwn2:doesn't list the resistance..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 07, 2014, 02:50:12 PM
LOL Visus - you're talking to deaf ears there - I won't ever buy another Efest batt.  pos pos pos  :laughing: 

So I got a bit irritated yesterday cuz the batts rattle a bit inside this case when I set it down or pick it up... I fixed that right up by removing the case's negative batt contacts and put in 2x Keystone C negative spring contacts... nice and snug now with no rattle at all.

Had to shape the contact's base a bit using the dremel so it fits and that neither contact touches the other, then used a pair of pliers to squeeze the spring a bit and torch it (like we do with micro coils) to lower the height of the spring - fits and works great.

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 07, 2014, 03:25:56 PM
Yea, rattles bug me too, even if it's hardly noticeable.  I've had that happen before.  I have a mod I use a lot that has just the tinest bit of rattle from the battery pack having a bit too much clearance on one end.  Only makes a noise if I set it down hard on the table, still bugs me.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 07, 2014, 06:22:05 PM
LOL Visus - you're talking to deaf ears there - I won't ever buy another Efest batt.  pos pos pos  :laughing: 



Shh my batts are listening....    :wallbash:

Now using a 650mah 15c lipo in a 4050c 12hr 3 ohm vape opposed to 4-6 hours with 700mah v2efest14500.  The lipo could go a lot further but I already ran it to 2.3v in one vape, after vaping past 3.4v it drops like a rock..   I love lipo's now ...

I was so scared it was a bulging bomb to be and monitored its charge, no bulger and it took the charge.. phew.... now charge at 3.6v and thats 12 hours of use uber chain vaping..  I love the 4050c...  BTW when I vaped anything under 2ohms with the efest they would heat up really fast -- the lipo ice cold.. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 08, 2014, 02:42:01 PM
LiPos do that, they puff up if you over-discharge them.  In general, a puffy LiPo is a bad LiPo.  I've had them do that a little bit even with normal wear over extended periods of time.  They can take some abuse, but for sure they don't like being over-dischaged too deeply.

They do peform well.  They don't have the best energy density of the Li-Ion types, but they deliver energy better than most of the others.

I thought the eFast batteries where decent, but it seems people have their issues with them.  I guess that's an avoid on those.  Doesn't surprise me though, it's always a bad sign when makers fudge the ratings, which they do to an extent on the eFest batteries.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: warlordxxx on January 08, 2014, 03:39:38 PM
I heard tell (and don't quote me on this because i'm not 100% sure) that the efest 35A was just a rewrapped LG 35A cell ...
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 08, 2014, 04:29:13 PM
LiPos do that, they puff up if you over-discharge them.  In general, a puffy LiPo is a bad LiPo.  I've had them do that a little bit even with normal wear over extended periods of time.  They can take some abuse, but for sure they don't like being over-dischaged too deeply.

They do peform well.  They don't have the best energy density of the Li-Ion types, but they deliver energy better than most of the others.

I thought the eFast batteries where decent, but it seems people have their issues with them.  I guess that's an avoid on those.  Doesn't surprise me though, it's always a bad sign when makers fudge the ratings, which they do to an extent on the eFest batteries.
EFEST
V2 14500 700mah 2pack
They are not holding a charge and are only a month and a half old.  They have not been abused, only overdischarged maybe twice after you warned me and Break said 6.7v toss on charger, I started noticing at 6.7v it starts a small rattle  sound and never went past that, so again they are pos....

Off the charger 4.17v, 6am today,  now at 2:50pm,  this afternoon they both are down to 3.90 and 3.92.  I bought two sets, didnt cost that much but its equivalent to two aw batteries that would have lasted me years..  So sad about it.  I had read this happening to others and thought maybe they had clones but no --  :wallbash:

Second set is still holding charge fine, crossing fingers I have not overdischarged that set  once but they are three weeks younger..   I am writing their company a nice email..

So was hoping they were an alternative to the AW, I know the AW is golden but the test results were just a hair off with the efest and the price is awesome.. 

The lipo's really are great for our mods and will be 99% of what I use from here.. Ice cold lipo stays above 3.7v for most of my vaping its unbelievable comparing it to the efest..  After 8 hours of vaping they are still at 3.8-9v about 10 hours  hits 3.7 and stay there, then  I am throwing them on the charger so they never really see 3.6 lol yes overtly obnoxious care now..  Easy enough just clip and stare at orangish led for two and half hours then I can vape like a boss again.  Dang 8060 vaping so powerful lol I am a weeny and that mofo packs dynamite..

They have to have some warranty or such in place.. 


The batts are a little warmer off charger as well, not hot but warmish unlike when they were new or the newer set which is ambient..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 08, 2014, 04:59:18 PM
Both the 30A Efest and the 30A MNKE cut out on the Raptor at 6.8v unloaded at the power I'm vaping at.

The 30A Orbtonics batts cut out at 6.4v-6.5v unloaded and the 30A Sony batts cut out at 6.2v unloaded.

All batts are rated at 30A, I don't know how accurate that amp rating is for each batt, but the Efest and MNKE have high internal resistance.  To me that is not a quality batt and it leaves me frustrated to get such short vape times and for them to cut out at higher volts.  And there's not a huge price difference between any of these batts.

The 5.6v zener diode is doing a great job of undervoltage protection cutoff at 6v.  When I posted before about it cutting off at 6.2v, I mistakenly used the Sony unloaded 6.2v without checking its loaded voltage lol.  Each time now I check at what loaded voltage the batts are cutting out at and it is always 6v loaded. 

So those Efest and MNKE batts have a horrible voltage sag under load with the Orbtonics trailing that a bit and the Sony doing a most excellent job.

I'll update when I get the LG batts.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 09, 2014, 02:54:32 PM
Internal resistance is a biggie and people don't really pay much attention to it.  It's the very first spec I look at when checking out a cell's data sheet.  That's the great thing about LiPos, they have very low internal resistance.  The super high drain round cells (like the Sonys) compete nicely with a LiPo, but for the most part, round cells have much higher internal resistance than LiPos do.

That's a very bad sign if you're getting big voltage drops (which means high internal resistance) from batteries that claim a high drain.  Drain limits are directly a function of internal resistance since it comes down to heat.  The lower the resistance, the less heat.  Thereby, the more drain they can handle.

There's a huge safety consideration with a cell that claims high drain that does not exhibit low internal resistance.  You can get into an overheating situation which is the number one thing to avoid with Li-Ion cells.

The fact you're seeing big sags in voltage with the MNKE and eFest 30A cells is a massive ding against them. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: c1truz on January 10, 2014, 10:55:20 AM
I've been watching and reading this post for a while.  Great job!  I looked at this module for a while but with my mind on using a MCU controller the 200 Ohm pot is a real turn off :(.  I need to make a non MCU mod soon though.  I'm about to go crazy learning all the programming.   UGH lol.   Anyway again...great job! 


Oh and while looking at those LG batteries.  They seem to all have disappeared in the last week unless you look at alibaba.   :Thinking:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 10, 2014, 06:47:33 PM
Thanks c1

The LG batts aren't sold out here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/321228740878?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/321228740878?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649)

I got the ones I ordered today.  Came off the charger at 8.6v so that was curious (I didn't measure them individually - just used the Raptor's input volts reading - wish I had measured them individually now). 

Been vaping with them since this morning on the Raptor.  So far, 0.0 volts drop loaded output, 0.3 volts drop loaded input.

Will update what the cutoff unloaded voltage is.  They're currently at 8.3v unloaded input, so that will be a while. woot!!  :laughing:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: rrtwister on January 10, 2014, 07:51:53 PM
Great job mamu  :rockin smiley: Looks cool and powerful. I think Captain Kirk had one of those. Beam me up Scotty  :laughing2:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: ADozer on January 10, 2014, 11:50:13 PM
Firstly: Awesome job, very inspirational.
Secondly: When poking around the data sheet for this and other dc-dc buck converters. I noticed that the Muratas have a maximum amp draw listed that is usually less than their rated maximum output, while the GE Industrial products have it listed as equal to the maximum output for the most part. Are they using a different rating basis for these measurements? Or are the topologies working in a different way to cause this?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 11, 2014, 03:25:53 PM
There's only two topologies commonly used for the modules, buck or boost.  There's only one commonly used boost module for building mods and that's the TI one.  That's excluding the complete boards like the DNA20 and other complete boards.  The rest of the modules are all buck which requires series cells.  Unless you mean something else when you say "topology", that would not have any bearing on it.

When a maker claims a power rating for any kind of regulator, it's always with respect to output.  It's generally implied that it can handle the input required to produce that output.

In terms of what a module can handle when the rubber hits the road, it depends on the maker.  Based on experiences I've read about, the TI modules are under-rated pretty heavily.  They can put out a lot more than the stated ratings.  It sort of perplexes me why TI would do that.  If a module can handle 80W why not state that in the ratings, but whatever.  I doubt that's the case for the Murata modules.  When they say 50 Watts, they mean 50 Watts.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 11, 2014, 03:41:39 PM
I got the ones I ordered today.

At some point, try a heavy drain test on them to see how much voltage sag you get.  I'd like to hear how they stack up against the Sony cells.  Like I said before, if the internal resistance is similar and the cells carry an additional 900mAh of charge, that's quite impressive.  I may use those cells the next time I do a mod with dual 18650s.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: ADozer on January 11, 2014, 03:51:37 PM
Yeah, I noticed that the okr data sheet isn't quite as specific as the naos raptor one when it comes to what the conditions are for maximum amp draw. I *think* its safest to assume that any regulator that can put out Xamps will draw Xamps under full loading.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 11, 2014, 04:08:17 PM
It's really dependant on the regulator.  For a linear regulator, they can consume as much as double the output power.  Since switching regulators conserve power except for some losses, they usually have input power only 10 to 20% above output power.  The better the converter, the closer input power is to output power.  That's defined as efficiency in percent, input power over output power times 100
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 26, 2014, 06:33:26 AM
I forgot - I was suppose to update this thread with the LG batts.  They did awesome for longevity and cut out at 6.4v unloaded.  Range 0.2-0.4v drop input load and remained 0.0 drop output load.

So the LG 30A 18650 batt has moved to #1 spot for me (because it has the longest run time) and the Sony 30A 18650 batt #2 spot (best unloaded cutoff voltage).  Hope the LG batts will be readily available soon.

oh... I was doing a search and come across an old thread where we first started talking about the problems with these converters with low voltage cutoff and the problems with the lead batt discharging more... Low Voltage Cut Out (http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-mods/193434-low-voltage-cut-out.html)

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: timesarerough on January 27, 2014, 09:54:10 PM
For those testing the LG 2500 mah batts (LGDAHE21865).....the actual model number is LG ICR18750HE2 and are rated as a 20A discharge batt, not 30A....according to my source.

There's no data yet on the net showing that model number, so maybe somebody has some time to check on LG's commercial battery site, assuming there is one....like Panasonic's?

My distribution source has these in stock right now ($4.60/ea unit price) and I'm also trying to get the same IMR's that AW uses.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bapgood on January 28, 2014, 03:29:45 PM
For those testing the LG 2500 mah batts (LGDAHE21865).....the actual model number is LG ICR18750HE2 and are rated as a 20A discharge batt, not 30A....according to my source.

There's no data yet on the net showing that model number, so maybe somebody has some time to check on LG's commercial battery site, assuming there is one....like Panasonic's?

My distribution source has these in stock right now ($4.60/ea unit price) and I'm also trying to get the same IMR's that AW uses.


I have seen several different LG part numbers with the same data sheet, a lot of which list max at 20a and max plus at 30a. I'm guessing max and max plus is similar to lipo c rating.....25c/50c  25c continuous and 50c burst.

Google came up with a big fat goose egg on the  (LG ICR18750HE2) part number you listed.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 29, 2014, 03:34:30 AM
LG puts prints a different part number on the cells than they use as a model number.  For lack of a model number, I've just been referring to the part number. 

Internal impedance is the defining characteristic for drain limit.  The internal impedance for the LG cell is listed as 13 mOhms which is inline with what a couple people here have measured.  That's about right for a battery with a 30A continuous limit.  I have some 14 Amp flat cells that are specified at 25 mOhms and some 44 Amp flat cells that have a 6 mOhms spec.  The 30A Sony cells are 12 mOhms.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: timesarerough on February 05, 2014, 06:02:53 AM
Here's the pdf for model number LG 18650HE2....found by (SonHouse)

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0By-7aw3qPc-oa09ENnNFMUtxTFU/preview?pli=1 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0By-7aw3qPc-oa09ENnNFMUtxTFU/preview?pli=1)

So I'm guessing that the cycle life radically SUCKS if used beyond is rated discharge of 20A?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on February 05, 2014, 07:14:23 AM
Here's the pdf for model number LG 18650HE2....found by (SonHouse)

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0By-7aw3qPc-oa09ENnNFMUtxTFU/preview?pli=1 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0By-7aw3qPc-oa09ENnNFMUtxTFU/preview?pli=1)

So I'm guessing that the cycle life radically SUCKS if used beyond is rated discharge of 20A?

The discharge chart, if used with an ego board 0.2c you'll only have to charge it once per year lol 

It is a sweet battery, revolutionary it looks like and with our use under 10 amps it will go at least ~1000 cycles before it starts to degrade beyond use.  Very nice post TimesR..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on February 05, 2014, 03:10:06 PM
So it's rated fora 20A continuous discharge which makes it an 8C battery.  Sellers must be using the burst limit when listing it as a 30A battery.  An additional 50% on the continuous limit is typical for burst limits.

The cycle life looks typical for an IMR cell.  You can see that it's an IMR cell by the chemistry specification.  Cycle life is longer for lower loads, but it's not going to be hugely better.  Probably lose 20% after 500 cycles instead of the 300 at higher loads as shown in the specification.

In any case, the specs don't deny it's an awesome battery.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on February 10, 2014, 01:55:07 PM
This is probably a stupid question, but I'm trying to get my head around how the zener diode works to shut off the switch below 6.2V input voltage. Can anyone explain? An equation would be nice for varying the shutoff voltage too :).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: warlordxxx on February 10, 2014, 04:18:51 PM
In one direction the current can flow through a zener diode normally however in the reverse direction it will only allow the current to flow when it's over the breakdown voltage. This allows the zener to run normally and effectively set a cut off point for the undercurrent protection of the batteries .. Here's a bit more technical info if you would like to go into the how and whys

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zener_diode
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on February 10, 2014, 07:22:05 PM
Thanks I'd already had a quick look at wikipedia

I understand about the zener diode only allowing reverse current through when over a set voltage is applied (5.6V in this case I believe) - OK I should have read further down the wikipedia page - the zener always has 5.6V across it if over 5.6V is applied I think.

What I really don't understand is where the values of 4.1V for the on voltage came from (unless it was experimentation) as the datasheet only says 'logic level voltage', and how it was determined to use a 7.5k resistor, unless that was experimentation as well?

Please forgive my ignorance, it's a long time since I did basic electronics. I'm better at maths ;).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on February 11, 2014, 03:36:28 PM
Well, 90% of electronics is just math so you should be good there ;)

There are theoretical methods to determine the ideal resistance and ideal voltage for this particular circuit, but sometimes bench testing can be more effective at determining ideal values for stuff.  That can be true even when designing involved circuits that require extensive design calculations.  It's pretty rare anyone can go from paper to an actual working circuit without the need to tweak something on the bench.

In this case, the stated resistor value produces a reasonable current flow when the diode is conducting and the value for the diode allows the logic to transition at the desired level.   You could do the calculations and bench testing yourself to find these values, but why re-invent the wheel.  Someone else has already done the work for you.

A diode itself is the most basic element of a solid state device.  It was the first solid state device developed and everything else came from that.  Even the first active electronic device was a diode in the form of a vacuum tube back in late 19th, early 20th century.  A Zener diode is simply a standard diode with the reverse breakdown voltage tuned to a particular value.  Standard rectifying diodes behave the same way, but the breakdown voltage for those is much higher, usually over 50V.  If you understand any diode, you understand Zener diodes.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on February 11, 2014, 05:36:35 PM
Thanks Craig.

This board looks like it could be used to create a monster of a mod. I'd use a 2S LiPo pack instead of the 18650s Mamu used, and I'd prefer to shut down at 6.6V rather than 6V so I'd need a smaller resistor than 7.5K, or guess I could add one before the remote on/off to create a voltage divider. I originally thought the zener was acting as a resistor above it's threshold to create a divider. I think I need to do some more reading...

On the other hand I might just add a LiPo alarm if there's room :).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on February 11, 2014, 06:47:03 PM
To increase the shutdown voltage, you'd want to use a Zener with a slightly higher voltage.  You can pretty much just add the same voltage to the diode as you do the shutdown voltage.  The resistor is only there to limit current flow when the diode is conducting and provide a voltage tap for the regulators enable pin.  The diode will try to always maintain the breakdown voltage across its terminals and the resistor is required so it can do that.

If you use a resistor value too high, leakage currents will drive voltage at the resistor above the logic threshold and the circuit will never shut down the regulator.  If you use a resistor value too low, power consumption will be too high when the diode is conducting which wastes power and can overheat the diode.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on February 11, 2014, 07:55:28 PM
Thanks Craig. That's really handy to know.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on February 12, 2014, 01:07:08 AM
Couldnt ya just use a 7.5k resistor at 5% or 10% and find the one thats  under for a few volts to bring shutdown up a lil higher at the diode.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sej016 on February 20, 2014, 07:42:24 AM
I have not been here for a good while and was pointed here for this build of the Raptor.   Very nicely done and documented, thank you.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bapgood on February 24, 2014, 07:02:33 PM
Added a housing for the 0.28" digit volt meter at shapeways - https://www.shapeways.com/model/1736356/volt-meter-housing-0-28-quot-digit.html (https://www.shapeways.com/model/1736356/volt-meter-housing-0-28-quot-digit.html)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sej016 on February 26, 2014, 12:24:18 PM
Very good !  So how do we go about buying these from the UK and what's the postage likely to be, please?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bapgood on February 26, 2014, 12:43:22 PM
Very good !  So how do we go about buying these from the UK and what's the postage likely to be, please?

Whatever Shapeways tells you it will be, they handle the ordering and shipping. I think they might have a facility in the UK, but I'm not 100% on that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on February 26, 2014, 01:48:29 PM
Added a housing for the 0.28" digit volt meter at shapeways


Great baps. Another great contribution. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sej016 on February 27, 2014, 06:56:34 AM
Whatever Shapeways tells you it will be, they handle the ordering and shipping. I think they might have a facility in the UK, but I'm not 100% on that.

Understood now.   You are not them.  :-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on February 28, 2014, 06:08:22 PM
HELP!

So i am familiar with OKR builds and so on, so i tried my hand at this build using the 120w raptor.

Everything works fine at 3.5v, but with a .5 ohm coil I tried at 4+ and it fires for a quarter second, and then stops, and sometimes makes a buzzing sound.

What could this be?

I used a MM to check for shorts and everything seems to be working fine. I built it as per Mamus build, minus the V display.

Any help is appreciated. This is so frustrating.

And thanks Mamu and breaktru for all the awesome info, this forum and such is downright amazing.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on February 28, 2014, 06:22:58 PM
Buzzing sound indicates that the board is starved for voltage.
Put a voltmeter across the batteries and see what it drops to when firing the atty
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on February 28, 2014, 06:41:53 PM
What breaktru said. 

Firing .5 ohm at 4v is only 32 watts and the board can def handle that with the proper batts.

What batts are you using?  Also, what batt holder did you use?  If it has high contact resistance contacts you're prob getting a huge voltage drop under load.  Did you use the SoShine case or one of your own?  I replaced the contacts that came with the SoShine case and am using the Keystone C sized contacts.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on February 28, 2014, 06:43:39 PM
Batts are at 7.5 when not firing

7.10 when firing.

They are SONY VTC4s
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on February 28, 2014, 06:45:26 PM
@Mamu

I am using a cheap 650 holder I got for free with a purchase.

It could very well be the holder.

I have some beafy holders at home. Once I get off work I will try a new one out.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on February 28, 2014, 06:52:46 PM
You tested 0.5 ohm @ +4v and that's the result you got?

That voltage drop under load is aok, and those Sony batts can def handle that kind of load. 

Does the batt holder's contacts get hot or very warm when pressing the fire switch?  Good idea to switch the holder out and try a quality holder with contacts rated for higher amp load.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on February 28, 2014, 06:57:02 PM
I turned it to 5v, and yes that was the V drop, all it did was buzz.

I will try a better holder. Thanks so much.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on February 28, 2014, 07:35:59 PM
Now put your voltmeter at point on the Raptor where the battery leads are soldered to and firing up the atty.
This will show if the battery holder and wiring is at fault.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on February 28, 2014, 09:26:46 PM
Breaktru and Mamu,

You two are God(ess)s.

Swapped out the holder and its running fine. Squeezed it all into a 1590G case. Tight as hell.

How did you know what the buzzing meant?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: thejewk on March 01, 2014, 04:57:38 AM
Cracking mod there. I have only made mods using the kis3r33s 4 amp step down boards so far, but I am either looking at this or the okr t6 for my next regulated project. I won't be pushing the limits of the board by any stretch but I would love to be able to run dual builds on a regulated device at both low and high ohms.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 01, 2014, 11:22:29 AM
Good to hear you're good to go now, Iamthebadass.

The whine, or buzz, is typical from these converters when they're not able to output and are being stressed.  If you were getting any kind of output you'd also note it was being pulsed - rapid on off on off on off type of thing with very little vapor.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: banshee on March 01, 2014, 11:34:41 AM
Breaktru and Mamu,

You two are God(ess)s.

Swapped out the holder and its running fine. Squeezed it all into a 1590G case. Tight as hell.

How did you know what the buzzing meant?

Yup they are.

Glad you got it all sorted out badass
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 01, 2014, 04:52:44 PM
Does this chip have reverse polarity protection?

Could I use a diode on the neg of the battery sled if not?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 01, 2014, 05:00:02 PM
No, diodes are very lossy and ones that can handle high currents are quite large.  You can use a fuse or a P-channel MOSFET to provide reverse polarity protection.  You need something there, the board probably does not provide reverse polarity protection, most don't, though it should provide short circuit protection.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 01, 2014, 08:05:46 PM
I am somewhat new to this...

So uh... How would I use a p channel MOSFET for this?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 01, 2014, 09:24:26 PM
An input fuse will protect from reverse polarity (see post #16 for the fuse wiring).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 01, 2014, 09:32:59 PM
I am already using 2 PTC fuses in parallel. So I'm good?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 01, 2014, 09:44:25 PM
Yes.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 01, 2014, 10:23:32 PM
Mamu, every day I like you more.

You are seriously a champ.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 01, 2014, 11:35:37 PM
I am using 2x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RGEF900/RGEF900-ND/1045803 in parallel wired according to Mamu Schematic, and when i put the batteries in reversed. things get HOT quickly and its not hte fuses, its the negative (positive) wire I am using 18g wire for all my current carrying wire. I am Unsure if these PTC's will actually keep a battery from venting as things are getting warm, and even melting doesnt seem like a good thing. I have tried a PFET -  IRF9540N  and this works great so long as you never need to get over about 4.8  volts output, or the Naos Raptor just goes into like a cutoff mod and humms loudly.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 02, 2014, 12:42:47 AM
The humming is from the chip being starved for voltage. The V drop is too high. Mamu helped me with that earlier.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 02, 2014, 12:49:06 AM
I think my Fet is not effient enough.  Maybe a different part would fix this?  I am kinda at the mercy of those that know better than myself, I understand how it works. just don't understand how to get the max performance out of it and build it so when i get a bit too much to drink i don't blow up my chip or batteries :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 02, 2014, 01:40:13 AM
I hadn't actually tested the fuse with this Raptor for reverse polarity. I had assumed both the converter and the batts would be protected with the fuse.

I did test input fuses with the DNA and it does protect the entire circuit, including the batts, from reverse polarity if one or both batts are put in backwards as long as there is an independent fuse for EACH batt.  If there is a common fuse for dual parallel batts, there is no protection for the batts from meltdown, there is only protection with independent fuses on each batt.

So after reading your post, sphearion... I just tested my Raptor for reverse polarity and holy moly it is NOT protecting the batts from reverse polarity, but does appear to protect the converter as there is no damage and it is still functioning aok. 

When I put the batts in backwards, the lead negative spring collapsed and that batt started smoking.

So once again, the way I have this wired - the batts are not protected from meltdown if put in backwards.  I should have tested this when I initially wired it.   :(

I will work on it and see what's what.  gawd this sucks.  :(  :(


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 02, 2014, 02:30:00 AM
Holy crap Mamu that's crazy.

I am also searching for ways to do this (easily).

Could you explain how a fuse on the positive side of things would protect in the event of reverse polarity? (It works in my OKR and DNAs)

I am just curious.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 02, 2014, 02:52:07 AM
lol for sure, badass.

You have an OKR mod with an input fuse and if the batts are put in backwards, both batts are protected from meltdown?

If so, I have no idea why a fuse is not protecting the batts for the Raptor as the wiring is essentially the same with the fuse on Vin. 

It may have something to do with the on/off control pin and possibly a fuse needed there instead of Vin, but am not sure.  Just throwing out a thought going through my head.

Simply put, a fuse is a current protector - it breaks the circuit when there is an excessive input current present.  In the case of reverse polarity where the batts are put in backwards a HUGE amount of current is dumped into the circuit from the batts.  The fuse opens at its trip current which breaks the circuit, stopping all current from flowing, and thereby protecting the circuit. 

For best protection, the fuse is placed at either the batt + or at the batt -.  If the fuse opens, it stops all current flow at the batt level not letting the current get past the fuse and on to the circuit.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 02, 2014, 02:52:24 AM
I have heard of people using N channel fets for reverse polarity with almost no V loss. I have not tried it however. Considering there are thousands of different fets, it's gonna take a while to pick the right one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 02, 2014, 02:56:04 AM
Also, yes on the OKr.

I just tried it where I put the batts in backwards. I turned it on and nothing happened.

I am not using the control pin though, that may be why the raptor is being finnicky.

Thanks for the write up on fuses. I'm still confused how it would trip if the fuse is essentially between V in and batt pos, yet all current is being dumped directly into ground.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 02, 2014, 07:44:16 AM
That is puzzling that the fuse works with series batteries in the OKR but not w/ the Raptor. Maybe someone would like to try the diode and the fuse as described HERE (http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,907.msg12399.html#msg12399)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 02, 2014, 05:37:24 PM
I don't get that either.  If the fuse is in series with the power supply and a fault current occurs, the fuse should trip.  There's no other possibility unless the fuse is failing to trip or there's some alternate current path around the fuse.

BTW, PTC fuses don't actually break the connection.  I know what you meant by saying that, but they actually transition to a high resistance state when they trip.  So, they don't stop current flow, just greatly reduce it.  It works in protecting things from reverse polarity by limiting current flow to what the components can tolerate, doesn't matter that it's flowing backwards, just that it's within tolerance.  Most essentially, it comes down to heat and as long as components don't get too hot, they're safe.  A PTC fuse keeps them from overheating due to excessive current flow regardless of the direction of current flow.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 02, 2014, 06:26:07 PM
Thanks for the parallel diode diagram, breaktru.  I've got a 9A Schottky diode on hand and will tinker with that to see what's what.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 01:00:34 AM
No go with the diode as the batts are still not protected.

The diode itself, the fuses (2x 9A in parallel), the wiring from the fuses to the batts, the batt contacts, and the batts get hot hot hot when putting the batts in backwards.  The rest of the circuit is fine.

So... I disconnected the on/off control pin, removed the diode, then put the batts in backwards and the entire circuit including the batts are protected with the fuses.  Without using the on/off control pin on the Raptor the batts are protected with the fuse - the same setup as with not using pin 1 with the OKR.

Is there anyone using the on/off control (pin 1) for the OKR module and also a fuse?  Can you test reverse polarity with this configuration?

I'd like to see if this is an issue with using the on/off control with just the Raptor, or with both the OKR and Raptor.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 03, 2014, 01:02:43 AM
that control pin should not even be "part of the circuit" until the button is pressed..... i bet even without the control pin, if you hit the button on the mods not using the control pin they see the same issues we are.

Unless it has something to do with the resister we use to pull the control pin to ground.

While I don't like the idea of firing the raptor under load like the easy okr, what is the downside of doing it this way?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 01:13:52 AM
With not using the control pin, I pressed the button several times with the batts in backwards and no issues at all - batts not even warm to the touch.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 03, 2014, 01:16:00 AM
While I don't like the idea of firing the raptor under load like the easy okr, what is the downside of doing it this way?  If its nothing to worry about and the chip is technically designed to do this, seems the easiest remedy in the short term is not using the control pin.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 01:24:06 AM
One time I had a board fail on me with a soft short, board got hot, battery got hot, but the fuses didn't trip.  Not to say your board is bad, just that it may be drawing enough current to get hot, but not enough to trip the fuses.  I could be way off on that being a factor in your case, just something to consider.

You don't ~have~ to rely on a fuse for reverse polarity protection.  You can add a MOSFET and that will eliminate your problem.  The only real benefit in relying on a fuse is to reduce the part count and reduce the size.  There's nothing wrong with using both.  Even with a MOSFET, it's still better to have short circuit protection in the event the board fails to cover that fault.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 03, 2014, 01:38:36 AM
the Fet I used robbed enough power that you could not use the chip at its higher settings.  While it did stop the reverse voltage, losing 1 - 1.5v of output on the chip makes it no better than an OKR-t10 IMO
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 01:58:35 AM
Just use a good transistor, won't be an issue.  The main power switch in my own mods uses a P-Channel MOSFET with only 2 mOhms on resistance.  At 20A, that's a voltage drop of only 40mV and a power loss less than a Watt.  Sounds considerable, but it isn't, only a percent considering you're inputting about 80W at those currents.  For the currents you would typically see powering an atomizer, it's nothing, at 5 Amps input, it's 10mV drop and 50mW power loss.

http://www.vishay.com/docs/62860/si7157dp.pdf
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 02:13:46 AM
While I don't like the idea of firing the raptor under load like the easy okr, what is the downside of doing it this way?  If its nothing to worry about and the chip is technically designed to do this, seems the easiest remedy in the short term is not using the control pin.

With not using the control pin, I had issues with getting up to 6v output - it would only go to 5.1v.  Never did figure out why, but once I hooked up the control pin, I got 6v output.  Also, to get an easy low voltage protection is wiring a zener to the on/off control.







Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 03, 2014, 02:27:08 AM
I am using a 6.2v zener between control and switch for low volt protection. and that works great.   I dislike not being able to get the full 120watts.   Not that i ever use it that high. just being able to :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 02:28:06 AM
Just use a good transistor, won't be an issue.  The main power switch in my own mods uses a P-Channel MOSFET with only 2 mOhms on resistance.  At 20A, that's a voltage drop of only 40mV and a power loss less than a Watt.  Sounds considerable, but it isn't, only a percent considering you're inputting about 80W at those currents.  For the currents you would typically see powering an atomizer, it's nothing, at 5 Amps input, it's 10mV drop and 50mW power loss.

http://www.vishay.com/docs/62860/si7157dp.pdf

Thanks Craig.  I ordered a few and will give it a go.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 03, 2014, 02:30:28 AM
mamu, what about isolating the control pin from ground not only with the pull down resistor. but also with a schottky diode. maybe there is some weird leakage there that is causing the battery heat, (im a noob just trying to figure out why the control pin being connected without the button pressed its only connected to that ground)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: whoi on March 03, 2014, 02:36:18 AM
Thanks Craig.  I ordered a few and will give it a go.

Very interested to see the final schematic.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 08:44:44 AM
mamu, what about isolating the control pin from ground not only with the pull down resistor. but also with a schottky diode. maybe there is some weird leakage there that is causing the battery heat, (im a noob just trying to figure out why the control pin being connected without the button pressed its only connected to that ground)

Tried it.  When I reversed the batts, the diode got so hot it melted the insulation from the ground wires - also burnt holes in the breadboard where those wires were and that reaction was fast - like a second or two.  oh_my:  but the batts didn't get hot.

So took the diode out and wired the fuse to the on/off control pin instead of Vin.  If you look at my diagram in post #16, I just switched the fuse from Vin to in/out at the fire switch.

Surprisingly, it didn't make a bit of difference for input/output function as the board functions just the same as if the fuse was wired to Vin.  But I had to also wire ALL the ground wires to the center ground pin and not the outer ground pin for it to work, not sure why that is, but when I put the batts in backwards, the zener diode caught on fire when ground wires were wired to the outer ground pin. 

I re-read the datasheet and googled info on this Raptor board, but cannot find why there are two common ground pins and what the traces are for each.  I wonder if one is just for the Turn-Table loop and PGood, but have no idea.  The Trim ground pin is independent and not common with the other two ground pins like it is with the OKR.

So I replaced the zener and re-wired all the ground wires to the center ground pin.  Put the batts in backwards and aok nothing gets hot let it set for a few minutes and aok BUT when I press the fire button the batts, batt springs, and batt wiring gets hot.

So I've got reverse polarity protection as long as I don't press the fire button.  :laughing:

But of course, this is still not a solution.

So with all the ground wires now wired to the center ground pin, I re-wired the fuse back to Vin, put the batts in backwards and no go - batts and springs and batt wiring gets hot immediately.  So the fuse needs to be wired to the on/off pin when it's enabled. 

I'm at a loss at what else to do, so will work with the P-FET Craig linked to when it gets here.

I just wonder if this is the same with reverse polarity with the OKR when using the on/off pin.  I've got an OKR-T10 on hand to tinker with, so may wire that up and give it a go when I have time.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 03, 2014, 09:47:39 AM
This is really weird mamu. Technically a fuse in the battery positive should do the trick.

I wonder if you put the fuse in the Negative of the batteries if that would help? Or perhaps also in the positive and negative of the battery.  :Thinking:


Update:
I have been thinking about the 2x 9A fuses = 18A with trip current of 2x 15.3 = 30.6A
Wouldn't you think that before the trip current is reached that things would get super hot?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 04:23:02 PM
Thanks for the suggestion, breaktru.

Tried a fuse on positive and with a fuse on negative - still no go.

By no go I mean that I have reverse polarity protection as long as I don't press the fire button.  The batt and batt spring wired to ground get the hottest the fastest.

I think I'll try a fuse at the junction wire connecting the batts in series.

I had wondered about that trip current being high like it is, and I think you're right, breaktru - that is a high trip current so things are going to get hot before it trips at 30A.  I feel the fuses during this testing to see if they are getting hot, and they're not getting hot.

When I tested the DNA with a 6A hold (2x 3A in parallel per batt), 12A trip per batt, the fuses got hot really fast when I put the batts in backwards and the batt and batt contact didn't even get warm to the touch so they were protected with the fuses.  And that was with independent fuses per batt.  With a common fuse, the batts are not protected.

I wonder exactly how much current is being dumped from the batts when in series when put in backwards.  I'm using a pair of the 30A Sony 18650 batts for testing.

All this time with all this testing the board has been protected, but it does have some overcurrent protection.  It does take a minute or so for it to start working again after a fault though.

From the datasheet:
Quote
Overcurrent Protection
To provide protection in a fault (output overload) condition, the unit is equipped with internal current-limiting circuitry and can endure current limiting continuously. At the point of current-limit inception, the unit enters hiccup mode. The unit operates normally once the output current is brought back into its specified range.  The typical average output current during hiccup is 10% of Io,max.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 05:03:02 PM
Thought about this a bit more and might have some insight for you.  The reason a fuse works in providing reverse polarity protection for a converter is because of the current path formed by the switching MOSFETs.  One of the characteristics of a MOSFET is it can only block current in one direction.  When reverse voltage is appliced to the drain and source, it behaves like a diode.  The formal term for that is a MOSFET's body diode.

Specifically, the reason MOSFETs behave this way is because the gate and source substrates are tied together with a common connection.  You see that in the schematic symbol.  Otherwise MOSFETs can latch on under certain operating conditions.  There are acutally 4 wire MOSFETs available that don't exhibit the body diode characteristic, but you have to know what you're doing with those since they can latch on under certain conditions.  They're often used in SCR type devices that utilize this characteristic.

So, under reverse polarity, the power supply sees two diodes in series formed by the converter's switches which is basically a hard short.  This allows enough current flow to trip the fuses.

I don't know why, but for some reason, use of the enable pin is limiting current flow enough for the fuses not to trip under a reverse polarity condition.  It probably has something to do with the switches the Raptor uses and the reverse voltage applied through the enable pin.  It may be causing one of the transistors to become active somehow and limit current.

The only solution I can think of for this situation is to use a transistor for reverse polarity protection instead of relying on a fuse.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 03, 2014, 05:23:58 PM
I want to try and use a P or N channel fet for reverse polarity, but every time I try to search I get confused. I do not exactly know what I need as far as drain source and gate source. It is really confusing me. Craig, could you maybe explain to me what each number means for one of these pups? And how it would relate to this circuit? (Ie. 30A, 8.4v)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 03, 2014, 05:32:08 PM
That makes sense, Craig. 

The MOSFET at the on/off control also allows us to use a low rated switch, even a tact switch if we want.  Whereas, if we don't use the on/off control, we need a rated switch that can handle the load.

The fuse in this situation with using the on/off control isn't protecting the batts and you're right, an external MOSFET is required to protect the batts.

I should get the P-FET you linked later on in the week and will update.

I think first I'm going to hook Source to Vin just to see.  If that doesn't work, I'll hook it to the on/off control.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 08:01:56 PM
I want to try and use a P or N channel fet for reverse polarity, but every time I try to search I get confused. I do not exactly know what I need as far as drain source and gate source. It is really confusing me. Craig, could you maybe explain to me what each number means for one of these pups? And how it would relate to this circuit? (Ie. 30A, 8.4v)

There's some old threads here where we've discussed MOSFET specifications in depth.  Maybe someone can be so kind as to link to one of them.  You might be able to find them using the forum search, that's almost a cliche, but it really can be difficult to find threads through the sea of results using the forum's search function.

There's also a thread that discusses reverse polarity protection using a P-channel MOSFET, again same thing to say about finding that one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 03, 2014, 08:08:30 PM
Thanks craig, I think i googled my way into oblivion, but i think I may have it.

And then I realized you linked a fet, so I checked it out and ordered some to try.

I swear I can never leave digikey without going "oh well I could use 100 more resistors... and capacitors... and diodes" Sheesh.

needless to say I am good on those for quite some time.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 08:27:29 PM
I understand that, I have a whole drawer full of components, but fortunately most of the chips are free samples.  I'll get an idea for something and order some samples, then decide to use something different.  Sometimes I buy a good of number of something only for it to end up in the collection due to a change of heart.  I seriously have about 20 different power FETs on-hand, just got a few more today from TI as a matter of fact, really amazing ones.  MOSFET specs get me excited, check out the ones on these babies;

http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/csd16321q5.pdf

http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/csd25402q3a.pdf

It's not just the low on resistance, but the insanely low gate charge, these are lightning fast MOSFETs with virtually no appreciable power loss.  Best ones I've ever seen, though the speed is only a factor for high speed switching like in a power converter, not a factor for reverse polarity protection or user on/off switching.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 03, 2014, 08:34:31 PM
how do you get free samples? I want in on this!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 03, 2014, 08:52:12 PM
Just ask for them really.  Go to a site like TI and create a user account.  Go to the samples area and order what you want.  They'll usually give you a quantity from 2 to 5 depending on the maker.  Some have given me quantities as high as 10 for free.  The one caveat is that samples are intended to be offered to professionals looking to produce products using the parts.  They will usually ignore requests if the account was created with an email from Yahoo or Google or other public provider.  Best to have a unique or business like domain on your email, but often an ISP domain will do.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 07, 2014, 12:28:58 AM
OK craig, I got those FETs in...

And they are smaller than hell. How am I supposed to solder onto these with no board for them to sit in???
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 07, 2014, 05:27:11 AM
How am I supposed to solder onto these with no board for them to sit in???

Just make a host board for them.  It's really not a big deal. 

You can get copper clad board cheap on ebay; link (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=fr-4+clad&_sop=15).  Any copper clad is fine, the thinner stuff is easier to work with and you can use 1oz or 2oz copper.

It's a simple pad layout, just three pads, gate source and drain.  You can probably use a Dremel tool to score out the pattern or you can etch the board using masking tape as an etching solution mask.

Once you have a board, just reflow solder the part on there.  All you need is some solder paste, not expensive; link (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=solder+paste+63%2F37&_sop=15).  You can reflow solder using anything that gets the board hot enough to melt the solder, heat gun, toaster over, frying pan, whatever.

Once you have the part mounted, hand solder wires to the pads and cover the whole assembly with heat shrink tubing for insulation and protection.

Careful handling MOSFETs, they're highly vulnerable to ESD damage.  You should use a grounding strap when handling them until they're installed in a circuit.  You can get cheap tape sytle ones that you can just stick onto something with a ground from utility power like the bottom of a PC chassis; link (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=3m+ground+straps&_sop=15).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 07, 2014, 05:29:12 AM
Thanks for the info.

I'm just gonna "borrow" and ESD strap from work.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 07, 2014, 05:49:18 AM
Reverse polarity protection for the Raptor... tested and good to go with protecting the batts if put in backwards and with no adverse effect on the circuit - voltage drop under load is the same with and without the P-FET.

Wiring in a P-FET:
Part # SI7157DP (many thanks to Craig for recommending the appropriate P-FET to use for this board - the P-FET I had used for reverse polarity protection for the DNA was no go with this board and I'd prob still be searching for the right one  :laughing: many many thanks for sharing, Craig!!)

S: Vin
D: Batt +
G: Batt -

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/p-fet-raptor.jpg)

1.  This is a teeny tiny smd part and needs mounted.  I used a 3x4 piece of veroboard and removed areas of  copper as shown below...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/fet1.jpg)

2.  Solder the source (green wire), drain (red wire), and gate (black wire) on the veroboard by inserting the bare wire end from the underside of the veroboard in the appropriate edge hole and sliding the wire though to the top, apply flux to the bare wire end, then apply solder to the iron and swipe across the wire including the copper traces connected to that wire...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/fet2.jpg)

3.  Position the P-FET in place, apply flux to all pins, then solder to the board - line up the gate pin (orient toward the black wire) and solder it first, then apply solder to the tip of the iron and swipe it across the 3 source pins (toward the green wire) making sure you don't solder the gate pin to the source pins, then apply solder to the iron and swipe it across the 4 drain pins (toward the red wire)... make sure the 3 source pins and the 4 drain pins have connecting solder and that the gate pin remains isolated from the source pins...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/fet3.jpg)

4.  Insert shrink tube over the P-FET and apply heat...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/fet4.jpg)

Updated wiring for reverse polarity protection...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7update.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 07, 2014, 06:04:36 AM
(many thanks to Craig for recommending the appropriate P-FET to use for this board...

Welcome, glad to be of service.  That particular FET has very low on resistance, less than 2 mOhms with the gate-source voltage of two series cells.  You should see very little voltage drop with that one, less than 20mV at 10 Amps.  In fact, the wires connecting it probably have more resistance than the transistor does.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 07, 2014, 06:18:37 AM
It's perfect, Craig, doesn't appear to be affecting circuit resistance at all, not that I could measure anyway.

And it's doing a terrific job - absolutely no heat at all from any component, including the batts when they are put in backwards.  I left them in backwards for several minutes and nothing, not even warm to the touch and the P-FET, fuses, etc not even warm to the touch.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 07, 2014, 06:45:55 AM
The FET actually shuts off when reverse polarity is applied so no current flows at all expect for a tiny immeasurable leakage.  You could leave the batteries in backwards indefinitely and not a thing would happen, not even the batteries would drain.  At least that should be the case.  You can verify that by checking voltage between the gate and source reads zero when the batteries are in backwards.  It will ready battery voltage when the batteries are installed correctly.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 07, 2014, 07:00:18 AM
Nice guys. Finally a solution for the Raptor.
So let's some it up. For battery reverse protection the FET will only be necessary for the Raptor. And not needed for the OKR or 08100w as the PTC will cover reverse protection for those two converters. Would you agree?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on March 07, 2014, 07:13:09 AM
Could I ask a (probably simple) question ?
Is this reverse protection only needed to avoid user error ?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 07, 2014, 08:04:20 AM
Nice guys. Finally a solution for the Raptor.
So let's some it up. For battery reverse protection the FET will only be necessary for the Raptor. And not needed for the OKR or 08100w as the PTC will cover reverse protection for those two converters. Would you agree?

The thing is, with this Raptor I tested reverse polarity without the on/off control wired in and was aok for reverse polarity - same as is for the OKR and 08100w without using the on/off control pin. 

So, I'm thinking with the OKR and TI board, both will need the FET if using the on/off control pin if wanting reverse polarity.  The Raptor, OKR, and 08100w are the same as for current control when using that enable pin.

I wish someone who has either of those boards in a mod and using the on/off control and with just fuses would test it and chime in about reverse polarity.  I just haven't had time yet to work with the OKR-T10 else I would do it.  If I get around to it though, I'll test it as I will be using the on/off control for undervoltage protection.

Could I ask a (probably simple) question ?
Is this reverse protection only needed to avoid user error ?

Yes - all this trouble and extra wiring and P-FET for having the stoopids and not paying attention.   :laughing:

Of course, if a modder is using lipoly batts with these boards, no worries about reverse polarity and no need for the FET.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on March 07, 2014, 08:39:22 AM

Yes - all this trouble and extra wiring and P-FET for having the stoopids and not paying attention.   :laughing:

Of course, if a modder is using lipoly batts with these boards, no worries about reverse polarity and no need for the FET.

Thanks mamu, I'll leave it out then. I'm building a raptor mod ATM for myself and as usual, I'm running out of space lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 07, 2014, 12:30:23 PM
I should be getting some of these 781-SUP75P03-07-E3 today from mouser,   I will update if these work as well because they could easily be added directly between + and - on the battery sled, giving you a new positive on the sled taking minimal space and without needing a host board.

Here is to efficient fets!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on March 07, 2014, 02:46:44 PM
Thanks Mamu/Craig just ordered one to play around with myself.

Now it will take me another year to order the diode, fuse, and fet lol..   :laughing2:
Still waiting on parts for MCU mod  ???
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 07, 2014, 03:20:47 PM
I probably won't be adding the FET since I only build mods for myself, don't use the enable pin and mostly use soldered in Li-Pos.
But if the need arises I know where to look. Thanks Craig and Mamu
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 07, 2014, 04:43:18 PM
Could I ask a (probably simple) question ? Is this reverse protection only needed to avoid user error ?

Yes, but the thing is, I'm the biggest idiot of all when it comes to something being idiot proof.  There is no doubt at all that with removable cells I will put them in backwards at some point.  With these high energy cells, it will definitely destroy the mod if that happens even if it's not matter of personal safety.

For non-removable cells, reverse polarity protection is not a requirement since it takes the idiot out of the equation, but in some cases you still need the short circuit protection.  Buck regulators can limit current and protect from short circuits, but boosters can not.  It's just how it works out with the difference in the electrical topology between the two converter types.  Also, even for a buck regulator, it's never a bad idea to have backup short circuit protection in the event the board fails to handle it.  That's not an unreasonable contingency.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on March 07, 2014, 04:57:48 PM
Thanks Craig, looking at mamu's photo, it doesn't look like the fet will take up too much space in this configuration so maybe I will include them from now on.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 07, 2014, 06:08:51 PM
I like these challenges for the learning experience.

I tell ya, when I was testing and that zener caught on fire it totally freaked me out - there were flames coming off the zener and melting it and the breadboard.  And testing with the diode and it melting the insulation of all the ground wires made me uneasy lol.

All for a good cause though.   :yes"

Think I'll wire up an OKR-T10 this evening and see what's what with that enable pin without a FET.
 
I should be getting some of these 781-SUP75P03-07-E3 today from mouser,   I will update if these work as well because they could easily be added directly between + and - on the battery sled, giving you a new positive on the sled taking minimal space and without needing a host board.

Here is to efficient fets!

Please do keep us updated, sphearion, as I am curious too.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 07, 2014, 06:20:24 PM

Think I'll wire up an OKR-T10 this evening and see what's what with that enable pin without a FET.


Will you be wearing your fire suite?
Be careful
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 07, 2014, 06:41:51 PM
I just added one to my raptor build. works like a charm. I am using a 1590G case, so it was really tight.

I soldered it directly to the fuses to save space. and its sitting to the left of the battery sled.

I literally have no space left in this mod, maybe 2x2mm left, but I seriously connot believe how little room is left.

It works like a champ.

Thanks again Mamu, craig, and Breaktru.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 08, 2014, 03:37:06 PM
781-SUP75P03-07-E3 today from mouser do in fact allow the chip to fire at 6 volts.   the fact that you can solder them flat against the front of your battery sled using by folding the legs to the left and right and the gate and drain legs are just long enough to reach the contacts on the battery sled, then bend the source leg toward the face of the chip enough for some heatshrink tube, and solder your + to it. and  it takes up very little space.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on March 08, 2014, 04:43:23 PM
Thanks spheroin, I may try some of these out as they are easier to use than SMD fets.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on March 08, 2014, 05:06:30 PM
That one's not too bad.  Looks like it has 8 to 9 mOhms at the voltages you see with series cells.  For the currents you would typically see powering an atomizer you'd be looking at about 25mV drop and a 75mW loss, about a half percent, certainly tolerable.  It's a bit ugly for higher currents, at 15A input, losses would be about 120mV and 2W which is about 2%.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 08, 2014, 06:21:53 PM
That's great news, sphearion.

Did you test input/output loaded voltage difference to see if there is any difference with using the FET vs without the FET?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 08, 2014, 07:56:19 PM
I did not test before adding the fet, honestly i was kinda excited to see if it worked at all,   The last fets i used if i turned the pot up to 6v the raptor would just humm.  this time, i turned it up, put my .8ohm atomizer on top and hit the switch while measuring voltage with my multimeter and saw 6.001 volts ouput loaded.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 08, 2014, 08:44:07 PM
I totally understand the excited YAY it works.  :laughing:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: sphearion on March 08, 2014, 09:02:38 PM
is it possible that a surge of voltage through a P-Fet could cause it to stop working, IE Inserting batteries? 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: whoi on March 09, 2014, 10:27:31 PM
Anyone have an updated schematic and part list (or just a labeled schematic)?

Nevermind, I didn't see the updates :0)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on March 11, 2014, 04:32:51 PM
I'm still working on my raptor mod and was going to use a fet for the reverse protection but decided to use the fet on the switch instead of using the enable pin.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on March 11, 2014, 05:02:32 PM
I'm still working on my raptor mod and was going to use a fet for the reverse protection but decided to use the fet on the switch instead of using the enable pin.


I am not sure if this was sorted but here's Mamu's quotes on that..
Quote from: Mamu
if anyone decides to use this module in a mod, I would highly recommend using the control on/off pin even though it adds a bit of a mA drain (similar to the OKR module).  Without it, voltage drop at higher output volts is significant
Quote
With not using the control pin, I had issues with getting up to 6v output - it would only go to 5.1v.  Never did figure out why, but once I hooked up the control pin, I got 6v output.  Also, to get an easy low voltage protection is wiring a zener to the on/off control.
.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Mandro on March 11, 2014, 05:20:56 PM

I am not sure if this was sorted but here's Mamu's quotes on that...

I've not got around to to testing it properly but as I only ever go as high as 4.5v I used a 240ohm resistor(that's what I had to hand) instead of a 220ohm one. With a quick test (unloaded) with a voltmeter, I'm getting 5.53v without using the enable pin.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on March 20, 2014, 01:42:42 PM
I have tested both the smd P-FET that Craig recommends and the leaded P-FET sphearion is using.  There is no adverse effect on the input/output from the converter or voltage loss from either one - both do an excellent job of protecting the batts and circuitry for reverse polarity. 

Craig's is the better choice and has the lower RDS(on), but if you have trouble with soldering smd the leaded one will be a good substitute and is much easier to work with.

Here are the specs for each:
Si7157DP (smd)
Drain to Source Voltage (Vdss) - 20V
Current - Continuous Drain (Id) @ 25°C - 46.5A (Ta)
Rds On (Max) @ Id, Vgs - 1.6 mOhm @ 25A, 10V
Vgs(th) (Max) @ Id - 1.4V @ 250µA
Gate Charge (Qg) @ Vgs - 625nC @ 10V
Input Capacitance (Ciss) @ Vds - 22000pF @ 10V
Power - Max - 6.25W


SUP75P03-07-E3 (leaded)
Drain to Source Voltage (Vdss) - 30V
Current - Continuous Drain (Id) @ 25°C - 75A (Tc)
Rds On (Max) @ Id, Vgs - 7 mOhm @ 30A, 10V
Vgs(th) (Max) @ Id - 3V @ 250µA
Gate Charge (Qg) @ Vgs - 240nC @ 10V
Input Capacitance (Ciss) @ Vds - 9000pF @ 25V
Power - Max - 3.75W
Mounting Type - Through Hole
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on March 25, 2014, 01:49:15 PM
NICE one Mamu...As always you build some WONDERFUL toys  :thumbsup: .Take a look at mine.

Look forward to seeing your next build.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: whoi on March 26, 2014, 04:41:58 PM
Just to be clear, the diode is for low vin protection correct?

That was  a dumb question after looking at the data sheet.

I got a 6v diode (per the diagram) but the spec sheet says max 5.5v. Is that going to be a problem?

nevermind, I got it figured out lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on April 05, 2014, 01:44:03 AM
Alright guys, having trouble with one f these. I am building one for a friend, and I have built ~10 previously.

All wired up, fires for a second and then sort of crackles. It'll turn on and off and crackle in between.

I tested for V starve. When fired it drops to 7.9 but that should be fine.

It's got me scratching my head because I have built around 10 this exact same way.

Help me out?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on April 14, 2014, 05:38:49 PM
Is this the correct zener to use there were so many just didn't know.                                                                                                         


http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/1N5339B-TP/1N5339BTPMSCT-ND/1114281
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on April 14, 2014, 06:12:05 PM
That's kind of expensive for a zener.  Radio Shack has them too, and those are uber expensive, but does save on shipping cost.

Here's the one I use: http://www.mouser.com/search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=WLTup5mM6hggalH74%252bUKpQ%3D%3D (http://www.mouser.com/search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=WLTup5mM6hggalH74%252bUKpQ%3D%3D)

Alright guys, having trouble with one f these. I am building one for a friend, and I have built ~10 previously.

All wired up, fires for a second and then sort of crackles. It'll turn on and off and crackle in between.

I tested for V starve. When fired it drops to 7.9 but that should be fine.

It's got me scratching my head because I have built around 10 this exact same way.

Help me out?

Did you get this figured out, Iamthebadass?  It's a new one on me so not sure what's up either unless it's a bad board or a solder connection.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on April 14, 2014, 06:24:30 PM
Wanted to mention I found this interesting.

I'm wiring the Raptor for passthru using a 12V 10A power brick.  When I connected the power brick the board started auto firing.  That was with the 7.5K ohm pull-down resister.  I had to go down to a 4.7K ohm resister to stop the auto firing.

I haven't searched yet why going from an 8.4V power source to a 12V power source would do this, maybe it has something to do with the current, but with the fluky breadboards I've had lately I'm going to double-check this on another breadboard just to make sure.  :yes"

And on a side note, the 4.7K ohm resister still prevents auto-firing when using 2x 18650 batts in series too.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on April 16, 2014, 01:45:23 PM
Anyone know a distributor where the Raptor 20A is in stock...
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on April 17, 2014, 11:36:53 AM
Bummer that all the USA suppliers are oos.

try here: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NSR020A0X43Z-Power-Supplies-Board-Mount-DC-DC-Converters-NSR020-NSR020A0-NSR020A0X43/333174_1063744974.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NSR020A0X43Z-Power-Supplies-Board-Mount-DC-DC-Converters-NSR020-NSR020A0-NSR020A0X43/333174_1063744974.html)

and here: http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/nsr020a0x43z.html (http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/nsr020a0x43z.html)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on April 24, 2014, 08:02:15 PM
are you also using 22awg for fire switch?....and ***update*** aliexpress is OOS on raptor
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on April 27, 2014, 09:30:10 PM
Anyone know where I can get one of these chips I'm only looking for one if someone has one extra for sale please let me know thanks all!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on April 27, 2014, 11:30:34 PM
all sources now are oos. most are backordered til july..I just got an email from a vender stating they have a prototype 120watt vv for sale @ $250 so I'm guessing ALOT of modders are snatching em up
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on May 02, 2014, 12:11:04 PM
I've been looking everywhere...I need a few for testing....no such luck
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on May 11, 2014, 07:20:29 PM
got 2 for testing from a shop interested in my work...Something pretty coming soon...  8)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on May 11, 2014, 08:31:01 PM
got 2 for testing from a shop interested in my work...Something pretty coming soon...  8)


Nice. We'll be waiting to see it
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 14, 2014, 05:44:26 PM
after looking at schematic does the 2 caps wire in series to pin 4 & 7 (counting from left) or paralell to 4 & 7? and if this is for myself there would be no need for p-fet and led correct just wire in fuse protection.

**edit**
I think I found answer in page 1 to wire in paralell...my other question considering min input is 4.5 it can only be powered by 2-18650' in series for 7.4 or will it work in parallel @3.7 has anyone wired it that way to see if it fires
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 14, 2014, 05:45:41 PM
GE just sent me 2 free samples and I'm itching to build. just want to do it safely and not injure the chip as they are hard to come by
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 14, 2014, 06:47:48 PM
after looking at schematic does the 2 caps wire in series to pin 4 & 7 (counting from left) or paralell to 4 & 7? and if this is for myself there would be no need for p-fet and led correct just wire in fuse protection.

**edit**
I think I found answer in page 1 to wire in paralell...my other question considering min input is 4.5 it can only be powered by 2-18650' in series for 7.4 or will it work in parallel @3.7 has anyone wired it that way to see if it fires

Yes - caps and fuses are in parallel.

The Raptor is a buck converter - needs a higher input voltage to step down the output voltage.  Buck converters require ~ 1v (it varies depending on the converter some require as much as 2v or so) higher input to output - meaning output needs to be around 1v less than input.

No one vapes at <3v, so 3.7v input is not feasible, plus you're not going to get 4.5v (min input for the Raptor) from an 18650 batt.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 14, 2014, 08:23:54 PM
Yes - caps and fuses are in parallel.

The Raptor is a buck converter - needs a higher input voltage to step down the output voltage.  Buck converters require ~ 1v (it varies depending on the converter some require as much as 2v or so) higher input to output - meaning output needs to be around 1v less than input.

No one vapes at <3v, so 3.7v input is not feasible, plus you're not going to get 4.5v (min input for the Raptor) from an 18650 batt.

Thank-you Mamu
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 15, 2014, 03:52:51 PM
Can you use a 500MW Zener diode or does it have to be bigger?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on May 16, 2014, 02:08:07 PM
You can calculate power consumption on the Zener pretty easily.  For example, with a maximal battery voltage of 8.4V and a 6V Zener you have a 2.4V drop on the resistor.  Current flow is 2.4V divided by the resistance which  is I believe is 4.7k in this case.  So that's a current of about 500uA.  Power consumption is the voltage drop of the Zener times the current which is 6V times 500 uA for 3mW.  So you can see that power consumption on the Zener is negligible.  You can use any Zener really, even one as low as 100mW.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 16, 2014, 02:58:00 PM
Wow you just hurt my brain a little bit. Lol. Thank you so much for getting back to me though
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on May 16, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Sorry, that was the long answer :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 16, 2014, 03:43:23 PM
Thank you for the long answer it was actually very informative made me realize I really need to get into electronic theory a little bit more
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 16, 2014, 09:51:35 PM
wow this raptor build is really trying my patients grrrr.. I cannot get it to fire no matter what I do.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 16, 2014, 10:24:59 PM
screw it this thing is going in the recycled failures bin raged:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: andy105 on May 16, 2014, 10:52:25 PM

S: Vin
D: Batt +
G: Batt -

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/p-fet-raptor.jpg)

1.  This is a teeny tiny smd part and needs mounted.  I used a 3x4 piece of veroboard and removed areas of  copper as shown below...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/fet1.jpg)


what did you use to remove the copper of the strip the board tired a razor blade and its a bit ineffective also i  got these caps 
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL31B226KPHNNNE/1276-2769-1-ND/3890855
and was wondering how i would parallel these tiny smd type caps  would it be the same method  as the pfet
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 17, 2014, 12:11:01 AM
so for the pot I see its wired with 2 wires only....trim- & trim+, so trim- goes to wiper and trim+ goes to one of the outer legs or do I have this wrong. I cant figure out why chip wont turn on. reason I ask is most pots are wired with a ground correct .
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 17, 2014, 01:05:25 AM
what did you use to remove the copper of the strip the board tired a razor blade and its a bit ineffective also i  got these caps 
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL31B226KPHNNNE/1276-2769-1-ND/3890855
and was wondering how i would parallel these tiny smd type caps  would it be the same method  as the pfet

You can cut the tracks of the stripboard with a spot face cutter or a small drill bit.

You can mount the caps on a stripboard if you want.  I just stack them one on top of the other and solder the ends together and then solder a piece of wire to each end, then shrink wrap the works.


so for the pot I see its wired with 2 wires only....trim- & trim+, so trim- goes to wiper and trim+ goes to one of the outer legs or do I have this wrong. I cant figure out why chip wont turn on. reason I ask is most pots are wired with a ground correct .

Did you wire the middle leg (wiper) of the pot to pin 9 (pin on the far left) - that's the gnd connection for the pot.  If you did, make sure there is a secure soldered connection on trim + and trim -.

Also, did you check the fire switch for continuity?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 17, 2014, 05:52:24 AM
Thanks mamu. This thing is awesome! Tough build. Took about 6 hrs.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 17, 2014, 07:27:44 AM
Mamu, yes far left pin#9 is connected to wiper trim pos to outer leg of pot. Switch is reading continuity also. There is just something preventing module from turning on. I have 3 raptors and did it to 2  of then which came right from GE. 3rd(digikey) caps are storing energy also. It has to be somewhere in the on/off remote. Cut it should still turn on even if pot is not connected correct?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 17, 2014, 02:01:58 PM
Thanks mamu. This thing is awesome! Tough build. Took about 6 hrs.

Well done and congratz, Jashe123!!

Yeah, these buiilds are time consuming but well worth it.

Mamu, yes far left pin#9 is connected to wiper trim pos to outer leg of pot. Switch is reading continuity also. There is just something preventing module from turning on. I have 3 raptors and did it to 2  of then which came right from GE. 3rd(digikey) caps are storing energy also. It has to be somewhere in the on/off remote. Cut it should still turn on even if pot is not connected correct?

Without a resistor or POT connected at trim, the converter will fault to an output of 0.59v, which would appear not to be firing since that voltage is not enough to fire an atty. 

Check all your soldered connections to and from and double-check the resistor and POT to make sure they are connected properly and the POT is working correctly.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 17, 2014, 02:06:22 PM
I'll go thru every thing again I have a idea uh en what it might be  the pot resistor is slightly under 200ohm not much maybe a little more little less. Also should it matter on resistors if they are 1/4 watt or 1/2 watt?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 17, 2014, 03:35:13 PM
@ direhavok don't give up bro. As far as the resistors go I use 1/4 watt for the smaller size of them. Works fine. Most 200 ohm pots have a 5% + or - tolerance so if it's @ 190 -210 ohms it's fine.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 18, 2014, 05:01:16 PM
So here it is..lots of sweat, blood & tears. But she's a vapin. Turns out sleds were bad not allowing full voltage thru. Thanx for all the support..what a powerful mod. 6v very hot...lol not gonna use at full output. 4.5v is good enuff.  :laughing2: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on May 18, 2014, 05:40:38 PM
So here it is..lots of sweat, blood & tears. But she's a vapin. Turns out sleds were bad not allowing full voltage thru. Thanx for all the support..what a powerful mod. 6v very hot...lol not gonna use at full output. 4.5v is good enuff.

Congrats  :beer-toast:
It's looking real good  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 18, 2014, 05:53:20 PM
Great job. Looks awesome. With my .3 build I found 4.5 to be just right.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: memoevapor on May 21, 2014, 06:41:52 AM
Very nice Raptor mod DireHavok. :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 22, 2014, 04:02:35 PM
So I am thinking of building another raptor box with USB port charging capabilities and also with a volt/ohm reader can anyone point me in the direction of an ohm/voltmeter that small also a small USB port AC to DC converter. I basically want to be able to shut the box and not have to open it anymore any help is greatly appreciated
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 22, 2014, 04:18:25 PM
http://www.stealthvape.co.uk/index.php?route=mobile_store/product&fspath=66&product_id=297.   

These are the small ohm/volt meters.

Dont know about usb

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 22, 2014, 04:21:40 PM
Thanks
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 24, 2014, 10:14:02 PM
I updated my wiring guide to include a master kill switch.

We've found that the zener diode does not block idle current drain, so you HAVE to remove the batts from the mod at cutoff voltage, or have a master kill switch, else the batts will continue to drain past an unsafe voltage.

With idle current drain wiping out our batts if left in the mod past the cutoff voltage, it would be a good idea to include a master kill switch, especially those mods with internal lipo batts in which you can't easily remove the batts.  A master kill switch also, of course, protects the converter from accidentally firing the atty.

The important consideration for a master kill switch with these converters that have idle current at the on/off control is to have a disconnect between Vin and voltage source.  With a DPST switch wired as shown in the guide, Vin is disconnected from voltage source and also on/off control when the switch is in the off position.  You can safely leave the batts in your mod for however long you like and not have to worry about current drain - as long as you remember to turn the switch off - that I can't help you with. :laughing:

(Edit: a rated slide switch is needed)

I also updated the guide to recommend a 4.7K ohm pull-down resistor, instead of the 7.5K.

The wiring guide is updated in the post where I posted it in this thread, but here it is also...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-wiring-mks.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 24, 2014, 10:27:37 PM
@DireHavok. Can the meters you suggested also be a volt meter display?  Also it says the input voltage is only rated for a 3.7 battery. I'm running two in series so can I use a step down resistor to power it? Was really hoping to only have one display on the box. Thanks
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 24, 2014, 10:43:13 PM
Its ohms typically used in resistance testers for atties
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 24, 2014, 10:48:51 PM
Yes I know. I was looking for a led display that can display voltage and ohms all in one and still have a voltage input rating of at least 8.4 volts. Just seeing if such a thing exists. I could use the meter you you suggested but I would still need a separate volt meter
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 24, 2014, 10:51:59 PM
New Raptor build only issue is the switch led burnt out nominal voltage was 2.8v I need the 12v one grrr *bangs head against wall.lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 24, 2014, 10:57:26 PM
Daaaaayum I love that paint job. Pretty sick. Looks awesome
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 24, 2014, 11:17:49 PM
I forgot to put resistor on led and it burnt out...another on order.. derp
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on May 24, 2014, 11:21:21 PM
Really nice job recessing it. I just got a 26650 tobh for mine. The air flow is awesome! Really allows you to crank the rapto up and not get a burnt taste. Plus it looks great on it.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 25, 2014, 11:03:17 AM
That looks sweet..might have to grab one
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 26, 2014, 06:12:56 PM
Is there an all in one volt/ohm reder small in size like the volt meter I currently have in my raptor build having trouble finding one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on May 26, 2014, 10:53:11 PM
http://www.stealthvape.co.uk/ohm-resistance-led-meter-pcb-board-reader
http://www.stealthvape.co.uk/OHM-METER-BLUE
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 26, 2014, 10:57:02 PM
I need it to do both In same display..and use a switch to go between them
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: djboa on May 27, 2014, 03:07:52 AM
I have seen a video guide on youtube sometime back where a constant current was used, so that the reading on a voltage display was the resistance.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on May 27, 2014, 10:07:29 AM
Love that video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nJSs3y8AwI


Fasttech has a v-ohm meter that would be perfect but it has limits, 1ohm and 6 volts.
They also have a small form ohm meter that does sub ohms but unfortunate, no volts. 


http://www.fasttech.com/product/1704302

http://www.fasttech.com/product/1716605
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 27, 2014, 10:40:02 AM
Yeah, lol that guy is confusing!!

I have some of the ECSTT volt/ohm meters.  So far no luck in getting it wired to reads ohms, but it's still early in the tinkering phase.  I can't trace the board traces to find what's what and it seems the board is somehow passing reading volts at one end of the board to reading ohms at the other end of the board, but haven't figured out how yet.  It does do ok though at 8v source, but that's with volts reading, it may not handle that higher voltage with ohm reading.  Not reading less than 1 ohm is a bummer.

Don't buy these: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10006752/1533300-volt-ohm-meter-for-e-cigarette (http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10006752/1533300-volt-ohm-meter-for-e-cigarette).  The wiring was easy to figure out but they are crap on accuracy.  I bought 5 and all 5 were inaccurate with both ohms and volts.

I love the tiny Omnitester that I did for my OKR passthru mod and the wiring was easy to figure out on those, but dang you have to bring the whole circuit into the mod (it's like 2" x 1") and you also have to include the separate PCB that's connected to the on/off/on switch plus a 4v LDO as source voltage for the Omnitester as it can't handle the higher batts' voltage without getting hot.  oh_my:

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on May 27, 2014, 02:45:01 PM
Yeah, lol that guy is confusing!!

I have some of the ECSTT volt/ohm meters.  So far no luck in getting it wired to reads ohms, but it's still early in the tinkering phase.  I can't trace the board traces to find what's what and it seems the board is somehow passing reading volts at one end of the board to reading ohms at the other end of the board, but haven't figured out how yet.  It does do ok though at 8v source, but that's with volts reading, it may not handle that higher voltage with ohm reading.  Not reading less than 1 ohm is a bummer.

Don't buy these: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10006752/1533300-volt-ohm-meter-for-e-cigarette (http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10006752/1533300-volt-ohm-meter-for-e-cigarette).  The wiring was easy to figure out but they are crap on accuracy.  I bought 5 and all 5 were inaccurate with both ohms and volts.

I love the tiny Omnitester that I did for my OKR passthru mod and the wiring was easy to figure out on those, but dang you have to bring the whole circuit into the mod (it's like 2" x 1") and you also have to include the separate PCB that's connected to the on/off/on switch plus a 4v LDO as source voltage for the Omnitester as it can't handle the higher batts' voltage without getting hot.  oh_my:

thats the issue I'm finding all the dual function meters are huge and inaccurate. I want small,if you figure it out let me know.

--and as far as the video it has way too many switches and buttons to be useable
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on May 27, 2014, 03:59:13 PM
I've used a very good DM for my Volt/Ohm meter and it is extremely accurate. I made it for my Spark-O-Matic HERE (http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,733.msg9175.html#msg9175)
The meter would be too large for a mod. I had problems using the smaller DM but I may have to rethink the circuitry.

Update:
Got it working with a small 3-wire DM and using only one voltage source for DC-DC converter and DM
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: BoKu on May 29, 2014, 08:52:08 PM
Can someone give me a part number for the 220ohm resistor please?  I have everything I need except this and am unsure which one to purchase.  Thanks!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: rvpps2rocks on May 29, 2014, 09:04:12 PM
Can someone give me a part number for the 220ohm resistor please?  I have everything I need except this and am unsure which one to purchase.  Thanks!
any 1/4W will work. 660-MF1/4DCT52R2200F
Can i get a part number for the master switch i read everything and still am lost raged:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: BoKu on May 29, 2014, 09:06:58 PM
Can i get a part number for the master switch i read everything and still am lost raged:

Thanks!  Here is the part # for the master kill switch per Mamu / TG39P000000
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on May 29, 2014, 09:26:37 PM
Thanks!  Here is the part # for the master kill switch per Mamu / TG39P000000

Noooooooooo lol - that's a non-rated switch on/off/on for the voltage reader - voltage reader doesn't require much current.

I never gave a part # for a master kill switch.  It's at your option which switch you'd like to use.  Master switch needs to be rated, but not at 20A though.  See our discussion of master kill switches in breaktru's OKR thread.  Good stuff there. :)

ETA: here's the latest updated wiring...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7update.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: rvpps2rocks on May 30, 2014, 02:08:49 AM
Noooooooooo lol - that's a non-rated switch on/off/on for the voltage reader - voltage reader doesn't require much current.

I never gave a part # for a master kill switch.  It's at your option which switch you'd like to use.  Master switch needs to be rated, but not at 20A though.  See our discussion of master kill switches in breaktru's OKR thread.  Good stuff there. :)

ETA: here's the latest updated wiring...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7update.png)
Thanks Mamu, Yea i read all that stuff and was thinking of just using this one 611-1201M2S3CQE2 but its still only 12A of the 18A capability/limit(based off fuse sizes)
Ive been doing just fine without it for about a month or two but since im designing a new box i figured i might as well include it. I guess if it burns up though ill just have to bypass it
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 01, 2014, 12:00:41 AM
Anyone else experience voltage output drop as the battery voltage drops. I have 7.5 volts so why is it reading 5.5 volts under load when I read 6.1 w/out a load
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: JUICYOHMS on June 01, 2014, 04:23:06 AM
HEY GUYS...THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL YOUR HELP & INFO...

GOT A COUPLE QUESTIONS...

COULD I USE THIS POT FOR THIS BUILD? IT HAS THE 200 OHM RATING AND SEEMS KINDA LARGE & PRICEY, BUT NICE QUALITY & BUILDING THIS AS A PERSONAL KEEPER PV, SO...
IF I CAN FIT IT, WOULD IT WORK FINE?


I'LL BE CARVING MY BOX FROM A SOLID CHUNK OF WOOD, AND THE 3/4" KNOB I'VE PICKED OUT WILL BE RECESSED A BIT, SO I'M HOPING IT WORKS OUT NICELY, IF I'M ABLE TO USE THIS POT. WILL POST PICS AND UPDATE AS I GO.

http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=151011821&uq=635371874908990300

CHEERS-
JU-C
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: DireHavok on June 01, 2014, 09:59:03 AM
That link is dead.


HEY GUYS...THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL YOUR HELP & INFO...

GOT A COUPLE QUESTIONS...

COULD I USE THIS POT FOR THIS BUILD? IT HAS THE 200 OHM RATING AND SEEMS KINDA LARGE & PRICEY, BUT NICE QUALITY & BUILDING THIS AS A PERSONAL KEEPER PV, SO...
IF I CAN FIT IT, WOULD IT WORK FINE?


I'LL BE CARVING MY BOX FROM A SOLID CHUNK OF WOOD, AND THE 3/4" KNOB I'VE PICKED OUT WILL BE RECESSED A BIT, SO I'M HOPING IT WORKS OUT NICELY, IF I'M ABLE TO USE THIS POT. WILL POST PICS AND UPDATE AS I GO.

http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=151011821&uq=635371874908990300

CHEERS-
JU-C
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: JUICYOHMS on June 01, 2014, 04:18:28 PM
Bourns Part# 3590S-2-201L
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on June 01, 2014, 04:51:07 PM
Bourns Part# 3590S-2-201L

It will work but.......

Here are some CONS:
1. It's large
2. It's 10 turns so you will have to turn the knob a lot before seeing a voltage change.
3. It's expensive. Because it's a 2W (not necessary due to low current for trim circuit) and it's 5%. Most trimmers we use are 20% tolerence.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 01, 2014, 05:08:59 PM
Thanks Mamu, Yea i read all that stuff and was thinking of just using this one 611-1201M2S3CQE2 but its still only 12A of the 18A capability/limit(based off fuse sizes)
Ive been doing just fine without it for about a month or two but since im designing a new box i figured i might as well include it. I guess if it burns up though ill just have to bypass it

That's a nice switch.  I've used the SPDT on/off/on version in some of my mods.

I would think you'd be more than ok with that switch.  It's rated 6A @ 28VDC and for parallel wiring you get the doubled 12A.  Craig told us you can safely assume a switch rated at certain amps for a certain voltage can handle higher amps at a lower voltage plus the contacts have a higher amp rating than the switch's rating, but those things aren't mentioned in the datasheet so you don't know for sure what max amps. 

What you can do as Craig suggested is breadboard it and see if the contacts get hot at the amp load you run the Raptor at or if you get a voltage drop under load.  Are you running the Raptor at >12A load?

Anyone else experience voltage output drop as the battery voltage drops. I have 7.5 volts so why is it reading 5.5 volts under load when I read 6.1 w/out a load

That's a pretty significant voltage drop.  Is this a new build or an older build and it's just now happening? 

What battery sled are you using?  What coil/resistance are you running at 6V?  The higher the load or high resistance in the circuit would cause voltage drop.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on June 01, 2014, 05:25:27 PM
Like mamu said, sounds like you're getting a drop in input voltage somewhere.  So time to break out the voltmeter and start looking for drops in input voltage.  The sled is the most likely candidate followed by the switch.  The batteries themselves can also be the culprit.  As batteries wear, the internal resistance goes up resulting in more voltage sag when loaded.  So if you're using tired batteries, try a fresh set.  I assume you're using high drain batteries to start with.  It's always best to use high drain cells when asking more of your batteries.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 01, 2014, 06:10:53 PM
Thanks Craig and mamu! It must be the batteries. I'm using vtc5's and when they are from freshly charged 8.4 to 7.5 it's not happening.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 01, 2014, 06:15:54 PM
I am asking a lot of the batteries my set up is a 28mm tobh atty with dual coils 22guage kanthal 10 wraps around a 1/8 " drill bit. Really don't need the full 6.1 volts I was just making sure I didn't mess up with capacitance measures. I used 2 22uf 16V caps so should be ok
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on June 01, 2014, 08:28:21 PM
The 22uF 1210 (3225 metric) MLCC caps are the best ones I've found so far for this stuff.  Specifically the TDK C3225X5R1C226K250AA.  You just can't do much better for the size.  You can use a controlled ESR polymer tantalum or maybe one of the polymer electrolytics to get more capacitance with similar ESR (which is important), but it's going to cost a lot more space and they're more expensive.

Sounds like you're really digging into the power demand there with 22 gauge coils.  That makes it pretty likely you're getting big sags in input voltage.  I know mamu has taken measurements and can say for sure, but IIRC there's a pretty liberal drop-out with the Raptor so you need to keep input voltage a good amount above output voltage.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: BoKu on June 09, 2014, 12:03:32 AM
@Mamu / I am sorry for mis quoting you earlier, my mistake. 

I have 5 chips on hand,  now im scrambling to acquire the rest of the parts for this build.  Can anyone recommend a good battery sled and a master kill switch please?  I am also planning to use two 10A fuses in parallel instead of the two 9A in the schematic to get the full 120W capability of the chip.  Am I correct in this thinking?  If there are other changes I need to make, any insight into getting the full 120W would be much appreciated.  Thats also the reason I am having trouble selecting a master kill switch, Im assuming higher amp rating than ones ive seen linked here would be ideal.

 Also, I was given a fried Hana Clone and plan to gut the box and attempt to fit this build within it.  Can I use the tactile switches from the hana mod clone as a fire switch with this schematic?  And how would one go about using the tactile switches for adjustment in place of the POT? 

I know I ask a lot of questions, please forgive my noobness.  I've been an electrician for 15+ years so some of this comes natural but it's really a whole 'nother world dealing with this tiny stuff lol.  If anyone can help me through this build i would be forever grateful and even willing to trade a chip or two for the help.  Im not looking to be spoonfed, just enough guidance to get it done safely.   THANKS!

 ;cheers;
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 09, 2014, 09:13:33 AM
You'll get the full 120W with the 2x 9A parallel fuses, but may have an inadvertent trip issue if running Raptor at 20A.  I never thought anyone would actually run Raptor at 20A, but I guess they are.  I updated the wiring guide for 2x 10A fuses then.

Keystone battery sleds (mouser.com) are the best for the low contact resistance batt contacts.  I'm not sure they'll handle 20A though, but you can check by running a test for voltage drop and heat from the contacts to see how it handles amp load.

I haven't spent time searching for a high rated master on/off switch that would handle 20A, so maybe someone that has would post the part.  Problem is, it's going to be big.

Does the Hana clone fit 2x 18650 batts?  I thought it had room for only for 1x 18650 batt.

You can use the tact switch for the fire switch as long as you're using the inhibit pin on this converter, but you would need a digital pot to have tact switches manage voltage change.



Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: BoKu on June 09, 2014, 11:59:25 AM
Thank you Mamu for your reply.  I think Im just going to TRY to keep things simple on my first build.  But using two tactile switches on a digital POT sounds like something my future holds.   And yes, the Hana Clone uses one 18650.  There is a divider between the battery and chip that I plan to remove to make room for a dual sled.   It will be a tight fit but Im confident I can make it work.  I just really like the size of the Hana, it feels good in my hand.   And I like the clicky tactile switches as well.   I just can't see myself using the Hammond 1950B that seems to be the norm for the naos raptor builds, too big for my tastes.

Also, Im a neat freak and would like to have all the additional components on their own board but space for said board may be an issue.  Any thoughts on that? 

Thanks a million for all your help.  I would love to buy a mod from you just to show my support.  I don't believe you are selling them anymore though correct?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on June 09, 2014, 02:21:12 PM
Howdy Boku, ibew 9 26yrs next month  freaked_out:

yeah its a different/similar world in tiny, and filled with wow.

Measured it out for ya:
Your going to have ~10mm of room to play with and only ~2mm for routing around the raptor, extra tight squeeze..
That is with using the keystone sled 1048-9  39mm x 77mm.  You can save a few mm by mounting keystone contacts.

HHana 18650 mod
DEPTH   25.7 mm
HEIGHT   88 mm
WIDTH   49.5 mm

Naos Raptor
20A: 36.8mm x 15.5mm x 9.2mm




Break has plotted and added schematics kindly for us for a digital pot..  --post 23--
http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,177.0.html
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: rkottwitz on June 15, 2014, 12:00:28 AM
I've looked on mouser and digikey and it looks like there is around a 3 month wait on getting a raptor 20A chip. Is there another place I can go to that doesn't have a huge back order?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jasen on June 15, 2014, 12:27:45 AM
you can try circuit finder places like http://www.oemstrade.com/ (http://www.oemstrade.com/)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Claviger on June 15, 2014, 12:30:07 AM
http://www.findchips.com/search/nsr020

Not looking good ...

http://www.vyrian.com/part.php?part=NSR020A0X43Z&utm_source=oemsTrade&utm_medium=SubmitRFQ

Looks like they are the only ones that dont have an OEM requirement to be sold to.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 15, 2014, 12:33:15 AM
When I ordered them from digi-key the website said they weren't available until July 30th I called and they said they would ship the next week. Mind you this was a month ago but I always call now
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on June 15, 2014, 12:52:25 AM
IF you guys want the ship date just give ge a call they will give ya ship date.

The last ship date 300 pieces, every single chip  was purchased in one order the very day they arrived at digikey..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: BoKu on June 22, 2014, 09:18:21 PM
Im vaping on a RAPTOR   :rockin smiley:  Now I can't wait to start another build.  1 chip down, 4 more to go.   I ended up using the 1590B enclosure.  It's big, but not as big as I thought it would be.  Pics can be deceiving as I was expecting the case to be larger.  The master kill switch I ordered ended up being too big so I omitted it, as well as the LED for reverse polarity.  As of now the POT, voltage meter and it's switch are just tucked in the case.  Its not as clean of a build as I was planning, but honestly this build took me most of the day so once I saw the light at the end of the tunnel, I just crammed everything in.  Couldn't wait to start using it lol. 

Thanks everyone for the help, you got me here, and it feels great having pulled this off  ;cheers;  I will spend more time planning out the wiring on the next one.  I know I can do better next time.  Id like to mount the voltage meter, its switch and the POT so that they can be used without removing the cover.  Which reminds me, these screws suck lol.  I gotta order some magnets for the lids. Thanks again everyone.  Big thanks to Mamu  :thankyou:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on June 22, 2014, 10:08:26 PM
Boku, no camera?   looked for your post..

wanna see that mofo..
viewing vaping mods has become a as bad on forums as talking bout your GF or Wifee gotta post up pics, leghumper pics preferably lol..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 22, 2014, 10:16:24 PM
Just put a raptor in a 1590g box. No pfet, fuses, or master. But she is compact
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on June 22, 2014, 11:23:39 PM
Nice jashe  tight biznuss tolerated  :yes"

Like how you cut the sled so it would fit the offset off the screw hole fits perfect.  I was in think before purchase about grinding it off but lookee there..

That must hit like a truck looks like solid 18-20ga..

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on June 23, 2014, 05:45:08 AM
Congrats jashe. Looks good  :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 23, 2014, 07:33:55 AM
Well done, jashe.  Good use of space management for that size case.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 23, 2014, 07:35:56 AM
Here's a schematic that shows a way to wire the Raptor for non-rated Master switch, non-rated Fire switch, and no idle current drain from the on/off control.  This can be adapted to any positive logic converter.

Been tinkering with it and good to go with both N-FETs I tested with, BUT I have not tested at high amps.  The SUP N-FET was recommended by a Vishay rep when I asked what was recommended to handle current load on the switch and the IRL N-FET I had in my stash from my Fistpack days.

I tried putting zener on Gate of N-FET, but is no go for positive logic modules, only good for negative logic modules.  Positive logic modules need zener connected directly to On/Off then tied to the fire switch at the N-FET Gate, while negative logic modules need zener connected directly to Gate of N-FET and converter on/off connected directly to Drain (I showed a schematic for this in my OKL2-T20 thread).

Many many thanks to Bap and BJ for leading the way.  I followed Bap's suggestion for N-FET using the 47K pull-down and after tinkering where to put the zener, I followed BJ's suggestion for keeping the zener at On/Off.  YAY it works!

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-wiring-nicd.png)

I should mention that idle current drain from the converter is off with the way the N-FET is wired, but the N-FET even when off will draw idle current. The idle current from the N-FET is the Zero Gate Voltage Drain Current (Idss).

This idle current is usually 1 microAmp which is 0.001 milliAmp which is a teensy tiny amount compared to the converter's idle current which is around 5 milliAmps. So big difference there, but still should be aware of.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 23, 2014, 07:58:49 AM
Im vaping on a RAPTOR   :rockin smiley:  Now I can't wait to start another build.  1 chip down, 4 more to go.   I ended up using the 1590B enclosure.  It's big, but not as big as I thought it would be.  Pics can be deceiving as I was expecting the case to be larger.  The master kill switch I ordered ended up being too big so I omitted it, as well as the LED for reverse polarity.  As of now the POT, voltage meter and it's switch are just tucked in the case.  Its not as clean of a build as I was planning, but honestly this build took me most of the day so once I saw the light at the end of the tunnel, I just crammed everything in.  Couldn't wait to start using it lol. 

Thanks everyone for the help, you got me here, and it feels great having pulled this off  ;cheers;  I will spend more time planning out the wiring on the next one.  I know I can do better next time.  Id like to mount the voltage meter, its switch and the POT so that they can be used without removing the cover.  Which reminds me, these screws suck lol.  I gotta order some magnets for the lids. Thanks again everyone.  Big thanks to Mamu  :thankyou:

YW BoKu!

I know it feels great to be vaping with a mod you made!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 23, 2014, 02:45:41 PM
Thanks everyone. And a big thanks to all those who trudged the road of the Raptor before me. I think I have a little bit of room for my next one to put the voltmeter and the three-way switch but you can't get chips anywhere right now.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Jashe123 on June 23, 2014, 02:47:05 PM
Huge thanks to mamu and craig for answering all my questions so quickly
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on June 23, 2014, 09:27:54 PM
Welcome, glad to see you got yourself a box that works well.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Claviger on June 24, 2014, 03:08:22 AM
Mamu,
 @ post 239........... very good idea :P
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jrweber02 on July 07, 2014, 03:54:30 PM
Was wondering if it possible to use a digital pot on the raptor with the diagram you posted for non rated switches and if so im not entirely sure I understand yet how the pot sets the voltage is the pot your low and the resistor the high and if thats the case would I be able to use same resistances for digital as the analogs?.... sry if its a dumb question but I been thru breaks diagram and kinda get the jists of the wireing setup but was just seeing if im getting in over my head trying one on this with dual buttons for up and down
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on July 07, 2014, 07:18:08 PM
The diagram calls for a 200 Ohm pot.  It's pretty hard to find a digital 200 Ohm pot, let alone one with an up/down interface.  Digital pots come in 10k or 50k mainly.  You can even find them down to 1k at the big electronics shops, but that's still not low enough.  Problem is you need the taps close to each other in resistance or you'll get bit changes in voltage with each click.  If you can find a 200 Ohm up/down pot or even a 500 Ohm up/down pot with 256 taps, you should be to use it without issue.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on July 07, 2014, 07:44:45 PM
A 200 ohm pot w/ a series 220 ohm fixed resistor will give you the ideal output voltage range of 3.3v to 6v.
The lowest D.P. that I could find is a 1K ohm. If you use it you will have unusable voltage settings on the low end of the output voltage like 1.5v or 1.6v when D.P. is max'ed, so the D.P. steps between 1.5v to 3.3v is wasted.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bmxer13 on July 11, 2014, 09:00:37 PM
looks like a great mod. wanting to build one myself but all the chips are sold out. no to thread jack but would anyone run a 40 amp chip? they have them in stock and I don't feel like waiting till October till the 20 amp chip comes in
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Ctarno on July 12, 2014, 07:22:45 PM
Anyone have any extremely easy to follow wiring guides for the raptor chip? Thank you for the help I really appreciate the help. I am schematically challenged.  Lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jrweber02 on July 13, 2014, 08:45:04 PM
Ok ive givin up on the search for 200ohm digital pot but quick question or request does anyone have a demonstration photo of how to wire the fets in the current update mamu posted for non rated switch
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Ray450R on July 15, 2014, 01:29:11 AM
Hi guys and ladies....I am building with a okr-t10 and I'm looking for the right mosfet for reverse polarity protection. It has to be small to fit my enclosure. Thanks
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on July 15, 2014, 08:26:01 AM
deleted
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on July 15, 2014, 08:57:46 AM
deleted - hmm, having problems today
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jrweber02 on July 15, 2014, 09:22:25 PM
.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on July 16, 2014, 01:11:02 AM
First Post here.  Awesome how to discussion you have here.
I just wish I could find some reasonably priced Naos chips.  Ebay is exploding with them but at $30+ a piece.

I will still be building one.  Might build a OKR T10 first though, seems a bit more simple. 

 :thankyou:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on July 16, 2014, 02:43:09 AM
The Raptor is interesting with the unusually high output, but few people would actually use it other than to say they did it.  I'm sure an OKR-T/10 can provide any amount of power you would want to regularly vape with.  If not, you're one of a very small number of vapers who actually has a need for more than 50 Watts.

Welcome to the forum, BTW ;)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on July 16, 2014, 03:23:24 AM
My current mech mod build is right around 60w. I doubt I'll go much higher than that. I'd rather have the extra wattage and not need it than to need it and not have it.
Kinda like why does anyone need a 600hp car.  8)

I'll build the 60w okr t10 first and go from there.
Thanks for the welcome.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on July 16, 2014, 04:18:28 AM
600hp pfft
The bar is @ 1200hp for street cred your still back in 2001 lol
Granma's Caddy a roll over ya @600hp dont let her pull out her Benz

The okr is rated @60 watts but will easily do 100watts,  it's suggested  rating is that of efficiency.  They tell ya on the data sheet its current limited @19amps.  :thumbsup:
The raptor is efficient at 90+watts, the okr is dumping spilling all kinds of gas over the hwy..  But yeah it will do it. 
Meh Raptor Okr, Ti 08100,  Okl, Lynx,  they garner bragginz rights is all,  the Okr t6 or the Ti 8060 are awesome too..

Newcomers always start in these huge dangerous build threads and wanna build em
The questions asked and answered, mod page should be littered with new builds but not see to many..

Howdy
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Iamthebadass on July 22, 2014, 02:20:08 AM
Having a problem.

I have built 15 or so of these without issue, but this one is new for me.

The chip only fires at 6v, when I adjust down, anywhere below 6v on the pot, nothing happens.

I'm at a loss, everything looks fine. Any ideas?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: deleon209 on July 23, 2014, 11:40:00 PM
NEED HELP ASAP. I got everything setup correctly and have broken it down and rebuilt and resoldered at least 5 times. I need help to see what im doing wrong. Here are some pics showing what I have.
It shows the battery input voltage with the meter but doesnt show output ever when switched to that on slide.  Please help this has been killing me for days lol

http://imgur.com/a/8vSIh
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on July 24, 2014, 05:00:23 AM
Having a problem.

I have built 15 or so of these without issue, but this one is new for me.

The chip only fires at 6v, when I adjust down, anywhere below 6v on the pot, nothing happens.

I'm at a loss, everything looks fine. Any ideas?

Maybe a pot issue or a board issue.  You checked the pot ohm range?

NEED HELP ASAP. I got everything setup correctly and have broken it down and rebuilt and resoldered at least 5 times. I need help to see what im doing wrong. Here are some pics showing what I have.
It shows the battery input voltage with the meter but doesnt show output ever when switched to that on slide.  Please help this has been killing me for days lol

http://imgur.com/a/8vSIh

Link or part number to the voltmeter switch you're using?  Is it on/off/on?  Did you wire Vout to one outer leg, voltmeter positive to middle leg, and Vin to remaining outer leg?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: deleon209 on July 24, 2014, 08:27:46 PM
It's the same volt meter you recommend. But the real problem is even without the switch and voltmeter it won't fire. I used a reg fire button a good one and nothing but I have that one that's a push button on and off so it can fire if connected properly. Yes everything is wired perfect exact to the pic you posted. It fired at first with no volt meter so then I disconnected to put it in box and shorten the wires and then when I reconnected it all it wouldn't fire at all. First I got a buzzing noise when trying then it stopped and just didn't fire at all. I've tried 3 different pots that all work fine. It's not the 510 because I tested it in another box I made and it works fine so I'm just really confused. I built a OKL t20 no problem it was pretty easy so I know what I'm doing its just this doesn't make sense at all. This is the second raptor chip I've tried. I figured it was a bad chip and built a second one and used all new parts and same end result.. Nothing no firing. Please help and look at my pics.

Thanks in advance
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: deleon209 on July 24, 2014, 08:34:18 PM
Yes it is on/Off/on it shows battery voltage but when switched over to the other side shows nothing and obviously doesn't fire
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on July 24, 2014, 08:43:08 PM
Ah ha. Buzzing sound is an indication of not enough input voltage.
Perhaps bad batteries, poor wiring from batteries to input of converter board.

Put your DMM and measure the voltage across your series batteries at the battery holder while firing w/ a load.
Then measure voltage at the converter board input while firing w/ a load.
Jump out/bypass your PTC fuses.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: deleon209 on July 26, 2014, 06:17:42 PM
yea i can feel the atty its hot but nothing is firing
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on August 03, 2014, 10:01:12 PM
Please guys, I am in over my head.  There will never be a retail market for this.  My lungs burn at 30 watts on my IPV50 Pioneer Yihi sx-330 upped to 50 watts with touch sensor firing.

We are extreme hobbyists.  Whether is is mamu, Imgur Reddit or any one.  I have all the parts and even bought the last Raptor Chip from Digi Key and I haven't even opened the electrostatic bag.

All I need is a knob for my 220 pot. I have the shaft. and every thing else except an enclosure. I have the volt indicator and want to use the master power on/off switch option.

I will agree to any non disclosure you want.  Sigelei does not even know if the 100 Watt version will go into production and suppliers are taking money from people against FTC trade rules on pre-sales.  So they are taking money in advance for a product which if ever produced will cost way less than they are retailing it.  I'm thinking of just selling the parts I have from Mouser and Digi-Key and Amazon.  I haven't touched anything yet.

What should I do?  If you want to laugh the funniest YouTube on vaping is 2 minutes long titled "vaping at 400 watts". The guy is using the Fogger large herbal vaporizer.  Nuts right.  People at most will go the the ego or spinner style if they don't want a blu or fuse.  Regular folks just want to smoke.

We are hobbyists no money to be make here and open source sharing is what got us from the original 510 160 MaH dripping to where we are now.

I will be grateful to anyone who helps point me in the right direction.  I have spent about $80.00 for the parts which includes two Raptor chips.  This is driving me nuts.  If you look me up on ECF same name tumbafox, I posted the first thread proposing a slimmer diameter spring loaded center pin atty connection several years ago to stop folks from crushing the seal separating pin from the negative housing and the techies took it from there.  Now we have the great fat daddy 510 connector.

Kanger just delivered a blow to the sub ohm RBA/RDA stampede by selling a sub ohm replacement core for the Aero and Protank lines.  That is better than the russian 91%  in my opinion. The tape is perfect from 1st draw until change out.  So why get a russian of $90.00

HELP!!!!

Stuart Goltzman


EDITED BY ADMIN:
REMOVED TELEPHONE # AND EMAIL ADDRESS
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: deleon209 on August 03, 2014, 11:20:31 PM
ummmmm
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on August 04, 2014, 07:20:11 AM
Although I am a newbie on this forum, I have been a newbie on this forum, I have been vaping since 2009 and modding for the last 2 years.
The Yidi and DNA Chips are no brainers although I don't understand why for another dollar in parts the DNA chips did not have reverse polarity protection on the clone chips.

But I have never seen anything like the raptor chip.


Ummmmm is probably the best answer  I am going to get.

I will say to all you sub-ohm vapers that Kanger just came out with a wick and coil 5 pack for the Aero and protank series which are awesume off the shelf products although playing with different wick and coil designs is fun.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on August 04, 2014, 09:06:47 AM
Howdy Tumba

The best I can tell is build at least one  raptor you went thru the hassle of purchasing. 
I know that 330 mod is awesome but so is the raptor.. 
Having two high powered mods will be awesome..

Yeah those subohm drop in coils are awesome but they will never be better than homemade coils only slightly match them lol
Problem is those type atomizers do not have enough airhole for those very low resistance coils IMO and people will think that what subohming is  :laughing2:
With the right set-up 30 watts and your lungs burned --something is not right, no way will your lungs burn when all thing set-up proper..   ;cheers;
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 04, 2014, 02:09:50 PM
Ok ive givin up on the search for 200ohm digital pot but quick question or request does anyone have a demonstration photo of how to wire the fets in the current update mamu posted for non rated switch

Reference using a digital potentiometer with the Raptor. I have been talking to some people and trying to do some research. I don't know if you can find a pot that low, but I know someone has used a quad 1000 ohm in parallel and an additional resistor in series to achieve the proper voltage range (3.0 to 6.2). The only possible downside is that they are using a microcontroller in their project, so it may or may not be possible without said controller. I am continuing my research, I will report back if I can make any headway.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 04, 2014, 05:09:43 PM
Being able to vape with high power levels is all in the atomizer.  You can't just crank up any atomizer and get it to work well.  I was not aware that there were sub-Ohm heads available.  If used in the atomizers where heads are typically used, there's no way they'll ever work well unless you use a regulated mod that can run down the voltage or power.

There's no away around the 200 Ohm pot requirement.  You can parallel a higher value pot with a resistor to get the right range (or run any other combination), but it becomes non-linear.  At one end of the scale, small adjustments make big changes in voltage and at the other end of the scale large adjustments make small changes in voltage.

I do find it odd they design these modules for a low resistance like that.  The design intention is to use a fixed resistor for a fixed voltage output, but even so, a higher resistance even for a fixed value would make more sense. 

Feedback for voltage adjustment on any type of regulator always uses a voltage divider.  I have yet to see one that doesn't.  That resistance you add off the board is the bottom end of the divider.  It may be possible to figure out which resistor on the board is the top one.  In that case you could replace it with a higher value to allow the use of a higher value pot.  It would take a brave soul to experiment considering the cost and limited availability of these modules.  You could trash one pretty easy screwing around with that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on August 04, 2014, 05:48:25 PM
Almost 3 yrs ago I put a digital pot in my Side x Side mod which has a PTR08100w which requires a 200 ohm pot.
On a 10K D.P. I had to parallel an 18 ohm between the wiper and RL. Got a output range of 2.05V to 5.66V. That's a range I had to settle on to get it working. Not favorable but tolerable.
Linearity doesn't exist so adjusting sucks but it is possible.
See: Side x Side (http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,244.0.html)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on August 04, 2014, 06:21:06 PM
Ya Craig they just hit the market  .8's some stores have the .5's
Reviews on the underground say you get one or two very good vapes then dry no matter where you dial the airflow.
Meh'  vaping on some local  homemade apple jack,  bought at local corner store he buys silly stuff for me and a few other vapers OMG its great
just had to tell someone
 :laughing2:
http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10004861/1770002-authentic-dual-coil-unit-for-kanger-clearomizer-5




Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on August 04, 2014, 07:05:51 PM
The new Kanger .5 and .8 replacement coils work great for me on my aerotank.  No problem with my Vision VV 1300 mah Ego style battery.

The battery has a dial that goes from 3.2 to 4.8 volts and I am having no problem with them on the Vision VV or Seigelei 20 or IPV V2 50 Watts

At .8 they There is no readout on the Vision VV but if you do the math 4.8/.8 squared times .8 equals 28.8 watts and  the vision battery takes it without even getting hot.  I don't know if the Vision is regulating it to some lower voltage but its a nice pull.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on August 04, 2014, 07:20:15 PM
That's because the vision isn't putting out 4.8V. It has an amp limit and will only put out voltages that don't go over that limit.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 04, 2014, 07:22:40 PM
No problem with my Vision VV 1300 mah Ego style battery.

Actually lots of problems;

Spinners and Twists are not rated for resistance under 1.5 Ohms.  It overloads the electronics and the cell in them as well.  At best, it will greatly increase the likelihood of electronics failure.  At worst, it could cause the cell in them to overheat and ignite (those are only 2C cells in those).

Those e-cigs are limited to about 10 maybe 12 Watts so even if you're cranking it all the way up, it's not putting out like a mod that can properly power resistances that low.

This is one of the big problems with e-cigs.  There's lots of things you can do wrong with them and some may impact safety.  When they sell these e-cig parts, there's really nothing that ensures people understand what they are doing when attempting to run high power levels.

Until there's a safe Li-Ion battery that is fireproof, safety is going to be a consideration.  Keep in mind, an e-cig is something that spends a lot of time right next to your face.  If these dual carbon Li-Ion batts deliver as advertised and actually make it to market, it may eliminate all of the safety concerns with e-cigs.   Until then, be careful.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on August 04, 2014, 07:37:36 PM
I agree its not smart to use the spinner but the Aerotank works on my IPV50 set to 50 watts at 6.6 volts and .8 ohms when I hit the fire button. The taste is aweful

At what resistance would you recommend for a good 120 watt hit?

Dont get me wrong I love my Russian but sometimes its not practical to do a recoil when your out and about.

Please bear with me but I am new to this forum
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on August 04, 2014, 07:54:09 PM
For a good 120W hit you need plenty of airflow and plenty of juice flow. That means a decent dripper, probably drilled out with dual coils for a total ohmage of about .6 (at 8.4V). Coils should be pretty heavy gauge or twisted lighter gauge and about 3mm internal diameter. You'll only need to take short, hard draws but you'll get intense flavour and tons of vapour.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 04, 2014, 07:59:19 PM
Initially the point of a sub-Ohm coil was to enable the power levels out of a mech you can get with a regulated mod.

A power level for a typical vaper may be something like 12 Watts.  Most people don't actually vape with power levels much higher than that.  With a 2 Ohm atomizer, you can can that at a setting of 5V.  However, at battery voltage you need an atomizer about half that. 

Power levels can be taken to the extreme which I don't see the need for myself.  People have their reasons I suppose, but it's not something I would ever recommend to anybody. 

You don't necessarily need a sub-Ohm atomizer to achieve extreme power levels.  You can get 50W with an OKR-T/10 running series cells and that's pretty extreme in my book.  You can do that with a one Ohm atomizer no problem.  A 120 Watt Raptor can put out the max with an atomizer as high as a half Ohm.  To do that at battery voltage requires a ridiculously low resistance of a tenth Ohm.

So it depends on what you're using to power the atomizer.  If you're using a 120 Watt Raptor, you can use a wide range of resistances to get those extreme power levels.  If using a mech with an 18650, you need an extremely low resistance to achieve those power levels.

In any case, I'm not a subscriber to those crazy high power outputs.  I vape at a level probably higher than most, but I just don't see the benefit in going any higher than 30 Watts.  I can't do it anyway because I get overwhelmed by too much vapor if I try to use power levels higher than that.  I can do builds that keep the vapors cool enough, but for me, there is such a thing as too much vapor.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 07, 2014, 01:48:06 AM
...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.png)

I have a Raptor box, wired similar to this. The master on/off switch is on the ground, instead of the positive lead. No reverse polarity protection, and the creator didn't wire in any fuses. He originally had a 7.5k resistor between the on/off remote and gnd, but I've replaced it with a 4.7k one.

I'm hoping someone here can help me out. The mods 510 connector (old school fat daddy) started to unscrew on me and the positive Vout lead broke free from the center pin. I cracked the box open to re-solder that down, which worked fine, attys fire again. But now they are ALWAYS firing, auto-firing. I saw someone in the thread mention needing to drop the resister to a 4.7k, which I've done, in hopes that was the issue. Alas, it did not resolve my problem.

I've also tested the 5.6v zener, and it reads close to the rated 5.6v under load.

Sorry for being a noob, I'm a software developer and I'm trying to get more in to hardware. I have built a DNA30 successfully, but that is a bit easier IMHO.

Anyone have any ideas?! I don't how much longer I will make it without my Raptor  :wallbash:

P.S. - I've tried with, and without, the fire button hooked up. I know this chip is ALWAYS ON, but the button that has been used here is NO (off -> on), which is backward from what I had expected.

P.S.S - Logic Low readings are within range, 0.37 volts (under the max of 0.4) and current is 67.6 (under the 200 max), so it should be OFF, but it's not.

P.S.S.S - well, F me in the A! I just accidentally put the batteries in backward, fried the damn board :'(
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 07, 2014, 05:35:34 PM
P.S.S.S - well, F me in the A! I just accidentally put the batteries in backward, fried the damn board

Well that sucks.  You need reverse polarity protection in some capacity for any regulated mod with removable cells.  That wasn't the best diagram to follow. 

Welcome to the forum BTW :)  Sorry it's with sad news on your part.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on August 07, 2014, 05:54:53 PM
Welcome to the forum _tek_
Wow _tek_, that really sucks. Sorry to hear about the board
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 07, 2014, 06:40:45 PM
Welcome to the forum _tek_
Wow _tek_, that really sucks. Sorry to hear about the board

Thanks man, I just ordered another one from eBay.

I have 2 of everything I need in my shopping cart on Mouser... Except P-FEt, not sure which one to order! Anyone know the right specs needed there?

I should look harder ;-) SI7157DP <- Just can't find them in stock. Anyone have a comparable part #? Thanks!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 07, 2014, 06:41:27 PM
Welcome to the forum _tek_
Wow _tek_, that really sucks. Sorry to hear about the board

I'm hoping the one I've ordered won't auto-fire as this one was. I still never figured that out, Logic was within spec for both high and low :-\
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 07, 2014, 06:46:15 PM
I'm also adding resettable fuses in the new build, basically I want to add all the protection that was missing  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 07, 2014, 07:29:04 PM
I've been using this P-FET for reverse polarity with my builds - D-PAK size: IPD042P03L3 G

And these strap fuses (2x in parallel): MF-LR900/20-0
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 07, 2014, 08:15:28 PM
I've been using this P-FET for reverse polarity with my builds - D-PAK size: IPD042P03L3 G

And these strap fuses (2x in parallel): MF-LR900/20-0

Found these in stock on DigiKey, thanks Mamu!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: shinzoku7 on August 08, 2014, 06:54:11 AM
hey Mamu could you possibly post a photo of what the nfet wiring looks like, i can follow your diagram but i get lost with the end connections for it and the location that the 47k res should be, im waiting on all the parts and want to make sure i can use the non rated switch i have as a master, any info is helpful, thanks in advance. :thankyou:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 08, 2014, 03:49:16 PM
You don't have to use an N-FET in order to use a non-rated master switch.  Just insert the master switch between Source of the P-FET and fire switch instead of between the Drain of the P-FET and fuse in the original diagram.  A master switch between Source and fire switch takes advantage of the low current at the on/off control so you don't need a rated master switch.  But there is still idle current drain from on/off control as it doesn't disconnect power so all it does is prevent firing of the atty.

Here's the wiring for the N-FET... the master switch still doesn't disconnect power, but it does eliminate the idle current drain from on/off control plus prevents firing of the atty...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-nfet2.png)


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 08, 2014, 10:20:31 PM
Someone mind checking over this parts list?
Want to make sure I got all this right the first time. 


P.S.  I left out the 1s-6s display since ill be getting that elsewhere.  Also, the PFET recommended is OOS, any replacements?  I may not even use one.  And 2 different pots to play with.

Thanks
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: shinzoku7 on August 08, 2014, 11:55:29 PM
Mamu you rock you are like a god with this set up, im a stickler for batt life and when i work i like to turn off my mods and the negligible idle drain is something i really wanted to do, you thank you a ton :thumbsup: :rockin smiley: :thankyou:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 10, 2014, 08:51:20 AM
Morning everyone.

Buit my raptor mod rather shoddy last night as a proof of concept, and now I plan to desolder everything, clean it up, and go with a smaller gauge solid copper wire, similar to cat5/6 strands.  I'm going to stick with 18ga for the 510 connector.  Do you guys feel the solid core copper is enough for the circuitry?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on August 10, 2014, 09:31:43 AM
Anything directly from the battery (+) to Vin, battery (-) to Gnd Pin and Vout to the 510 requires hvy wire such as your 18ga wire.
Everything else can be lighter gauge such as your solid cat 5/6 wire.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 10, 2014, 10:56:09 AM
Thanks :). Now I have to go find another mofset because I broke the center leg off of the only one I ordered  :wallbash:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 10, 2014, 11:10:21 AM
In theory, I could just do without the p channel MOSFET as long as I mark the battery holder with the correct battery orientation to ensure I don't install the batteries backwards, no?  From the schematic it seems that its only there for reverse polarity protection. (Sorry if this is covered elsewhere)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 10, 2014, 11:12:50 AM
In theory, I could just do without the p channel MOSFET as long as I mark the battery holder with the correct battery orientation to ensure I don't install the batteries backwards, no?  From the schematic it seems that its only there for reverse polarity protection. (Sorry if this is covered elsewhere)

Yep, that's all, but I just fried my chip 2 days ago putting batts in backward, just a simple slip and now it's gone :-( my new chip will arrive tomorrow and you better bet your ads I have 2 Mosfets right here in front of me ;-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 10, 2014, 06:47:45 PM
Now I have to go find another mofset because I broke the center leg off of the only one I ordered

Hehe, never order just one of anything.

You might be tempted to say, "well, I'll just be careful."  I've found after years of doing stuff with electronics, that never works.  If it's possible to hook something up incorrectly, I'll invariably do it at some point.

Don't neglect reverse polarity protection unless you are using non-removable cells that eliminate the possibility.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 10, 2014, 06:51:26 PM
I ordered replacements already :). I was going to go to RadioShack but then I remembered how much they've changed in 20 years, and how unlikely they are to have the p channel MOSFET that's required.  :(

I wish there were an electronics hobby store near me.

As an aside, I also ordered a fuse block for micro buss fuses.  It'll hold two fuses so it should be a clean little compartment :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 10, 2014, 07:04:48 PM
Brick and mortar electronics shops are going pretty much by the wayside now.  There was one in my town, it's gone now.  These days you pretty much have to order things online. 

It sucks you can't just run out and buy stuff when you need it, but on the other hand, you don't waste time and money fetching parts.  Then the selection is vast from places like Mouser, Digikey, Newark, etc. 

When I used to buy from B&M shops years ago, there were times they didn't have what I need in stock.  That almost never happens with the big online shops.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 10, 2014, 07:11:08 PM
Someone mind checking over this parts list?
Want to make sure I got all this right the first time. 


P.S.  I left out the 1s-6s display since ill be getting that elsewhere.  Also, the PFET recommended is OOS, any replacements?  I may not even use one.  And 2 different pots to play with.

Thanks

The lack of an NFET in your parts list leads me to believe you are using the original wiring diagram provided by mamu and not the one she posted earlier up on this page. If you are using that diagram, the fire (http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/PV6F240SS-341/EG4732-ND/2116211) switch you chose won't work. It is only rated at two amps instead of the required 20. Throw an NFET and a couple of other parts into the mix and you can use that switch since in the other scheme it doesn't have to be rated.

EDIT: Never mind. I was confusing fire switch and master switch. Carry on!!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 10, 2014, 08:46:47 PM
I think Mouser has the PFET and NFET in stock. 
Think the only thing left to find is a 200ohm pot and a nice knob for it. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 11, 2014, 10:00:18 AM
So, I hope this is ok with Mamu and the crew, but I redrew the circuit for the Raptor. I had some free time and am trying to figure out Eagle Cad so I figured this was a pretty good little project to work on. Hope I'm not stepping on anyone's toes. Just trying to help clear some stuff up for any new comers and myself.

(http://i.imgur.com/wkKvuG9.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 11, 2014, 11:05:39 AM
lol no you're not stepping on toes to draw a schematic for the Raptor.  No one has a claim on that sort of thing.

Two concerns -
I understand your intent to give me credit for the original diagram and thank you for that, but this is your schematic, your work, not mine.  Please remove asap "Raptor Circuit Design by Mamu" and the text box copied from my diagram.  Replace with your name and your words.

I haven't checked over everything in your schematic, but the fire switch, zener diode, and on/off control are not wired correctly.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 11, 2014, 11:10:23 AM
Thanks, mamu! I pulled the image down for the time being while I fix my mistakes.

I'll admit that I got a bit lazy and copied your paragraph about the Sense pins without rewriting, apologies for that. And I will look over those parts in the schematic again and rewire them. Even after double and triple checking I knew I would muck something up, lol.


Edit: Diagram was changed and added back to the post. Can't believe I botched the zener/fire switch setup. I think it is correct now. I appreciate your help and understanding. Many thanks, mamu!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 11, 2014, 02:54:11 PM
For anyone looking, digikey just received more stock of the Raptor chip.  I just ordered two more. :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 11, 2014, 03:28:48 PM
For anyone looking, digikey just received more stock of the Raptor chip.  I just ordered two more. :)

Good lookin Cliff!!!!! Just ordered two more, I needed one of them for a friend, the other is "just in case".

 :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 11, 2014, 06:03:40 PM
No worries!  I know they're hard to come by, and even more so when eBay vendors are snatching them up for resale.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 11, 2014, 07:31:59 PM
Where is everyone connecting their ground connections? 
Negative on battery holder?  As grounding to chassis wouldn't be very easy. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cliff p on August 11, 2014, 08:37:09 PM
Yes.  Negative terminal on the battery block.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 12, 2014, 01:12:05 AM
I've been using this P-FET for reverse polarity with my builds - D-PAK size: IPD042P03L3 G

And these strap fuses (2x in parallel): MF-LR900/20-0

How are you soldering these PFETS and fuses? Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 12, 2014, 06:29:47 PM
How are you soldering these PFETS and fuses? Thanks in advance.

There's nothing different or special with soldering these parts.  I do scruff up the ends of the fuses before applying flux and solder though and use 18ga stranded wires for connections.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cghildreth on August 12, 2014, 07:18:37 PM
Wow.  Mamu, Breaktru, Craig, and others - thank you for all the time you're spending sharing ideas and knowledge!  I've built a few DNA and SX350 mods, but this Raptor build is a whole other world - one that I don't understand very well.  I've ordered a few raptor chips while they're available, but am not going to build them until I understand a few more things. While I could blindly follow your tutorials, I don't like to do things that could result in a blown battery next to my face without understanding exactly what each component does, how it works, and what the safety concerns are with combining it all together.  Doing so seems a bit foolish to me, so my task is to learn!  I've taken a basic DC class in college several years back, so I have a very solid handle on ohm's law, how voltage, resistance, capacitance works in theory, etc., but don't have any real handle on how to design/troubleshoot anything more than the most basic of circuits. 

 I've gotten a book to help me learn (Practical Electronics for Inventors), but wonder if you have any suggestions for texts to read that can help a noob understand some of the basics. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 12, 2014, 07:57:29 PM
That's good you are looking to understand how these things work.  Until a safe battery comes along that can perform as well as a Li-Ion, you really need to know what you're doing.  There is one promising technology on the horizon that may resolve the safety issue, but until then, a person has to be careful with this stuff.  I have an online buddy that runs a vape shop, I've heard some crazy stories from him about things people have attempted.

I always recommend the tutorials here; http://www.allaboutcircuits.com   The texts are really well written and there's plenty of depth for anything you would want to do with mod building.

Welcome to the forum BTW :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: LeeM on August 12, 2014, 08:39:18 PM
can anyone help me out a little here please? are we still using the diagram here? http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.png

now I've got the following parts in my basket;
some of these fuses http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155353817&uq=635434691059434000
some of these capacitors http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155317805&uq=635434673485121858
these 220 resistors http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319591&uq=635434673677021801
and these 4.7k http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319633&uq=635434673912408597
this zener http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319897&uq=635434674038627483
this mosfet http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155353468&uq=635434689225505673
and this pot http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155324624&uq=635434674197434465

could anyone let me know if they're all correct?

also does that allow me to use a non rated fire button, but still need to use a 20amp main switch?

thanks in advance
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 12, 2014, 08:41:28 PM
can anyone help me out a little here please? are we still using the diagram here? http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.png

now I've got the following parts in my basket;
some of these fuses http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155353817&uq=635434691059434000
some of these capacitors http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155317805&uq=635434673485121858
these 220 resistors http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319591&uq=635434673677021801
and these 4.7k http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319633&uq=635434673912408597
this zener http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155319897&uq=635434674038627483
this mosfet http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155353468&uq=635434689225505673
and this pot http://www.digikey.co.uk/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=155324624&uq=635434674197434465

could anyone let me know if they're all correct?

also does that allow me to use a non rated fire button, but still need to use a 20amp main switch?

thanks in advance

You might check your post. All of those links were broken for me.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: LeeM on August 12, 2014, 08:43:19 PM
thats odd, they all work when i click
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 13, 2014, 01:19:31 AM
thats odd, they all work when i click

Not sure what the issue is. I get a 404 error on every page in chrome/safari/firefox.

Using that diagram means yes you need the rated master switch. This is because all of the voltage/amperage passed to the atomizer goes through that switch. That means if you turn the module all the way up to 6v and fire a .30 ohm coil on your atty, you will be pulling 20 amps out of your batteries. The switch must be able to handle that amount of current.

The fire switch does not need to be rated. All it does is pass a signal to the on off pin. The maximum amount of current that pin will pull through the fire switch is .5 mA. Just about any switch should be able to handle that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: LeeM on August 13, 2014, 06:49:23 AM
thanks yeah I've been looking at various diagrams for hours and can see how the firing switch works there now. took a good few hours but i think I've worked out how it all works now, thanks in a large part to this thread.

think I've learnt more about mosfets and zener diodes in the last 24 hours than i remember from a foundation degree in engineering haha
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cghildreth on August 13, 2014, 10:11:04 AM
I always recommend the tutorials here; http://www.allaboutcircuits.com   The texts are really well written and there's plenty of depth for anything you would want to do with mod building.

Welcome to the forum BTW :)

Thanks Craig!  I started looking and there is an amazing amount of material there. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 15, 2014, 12:50:48 AM
Hmm whats everyone using for a 20a rated master switch?
Cant seem to find one that isn't huge.

Got my raptor, fire switch, enclosure and battery sled in on Wednesday.   8)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: werkkrew on August 15, 2014, 12:50:35 PM
I had a question about this build, and for that matter, any of the Naos Raptor / OKR / OKL builds -

Does the DC/DC converter limit itself to the max output voltage in the spec sheet, regardless of the resistors used on the trim pins?  For example, according to the spec sheet of the 20A Naos Raptor, 220ohm trim = 6V output, in my build I used a 180ohm in front of the pot which according to the formula on the spec sheet would produce output of 7.0v.  Completely ignoring the potential to fry the chip or any safety concerns, is it possible to run these out of spec?  When I put a load on mine I notice the output limits itself to 6.0v automatically and I am not sure if its a "feature" of the converter or just a coincidental voltage drop on the output.

For this converter in particular, 0.3ohm @ 6v = 20A / 120w, but what if I wanted to run a 1.5 ohm coil @ 7.5v (5A ~38w) is that possible? 

Or, if the output is limited to 6V does it also limit the current to 20A?  So if I put a 0.2 ohm coil on it and set the output to max, will it automatically drop the output to 4 volts?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 15, 2014, 01:52:12 PM
Converters typically limit output only by switching current which is dependent on power output and also to an extent on input voltage.  The converter will not limit voltage until power output is exceeded.  In that case you could damage the part by over-driving voltage or current.  If the data sheet indicates 6V and 20A is the maximum, then you risk damaging the part if you try to run either harder than that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: werkkrew on August 15, 2014, 01:56:03 PM
I understand the whole "risk damage" part, but it seems that in my experience the raptor wont even allow itself to exceed 6v / 20A.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 15, 2014, 01:58:34 PM
I understand the whole "risk damage" part, but it seems that in my experience the raptor wont even allow itself to exceed 6v / 20A.

I've pushed Raptors upwards of 140 watts, 25 amps without damage. But not for extended periods of use. That was under 6v though.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: werkkrew on August 15, 2014, 02:02:09 PM
Okay, so you can run it out of spec on the amperage/wattage side by using <6v and lower resistance, but can you make it go above 6V on higher resistance coils?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 15, 2014, 02:09:58 PM
I understand the whole "risk damage" part, but it seems that in my experience the raptor wont even allow itself to exceed 6v / 20A.

That may be the case, but then it makes the question moot since the converter won't allow it anyway. 

With any part there's a rating which always applies to a continuous load.  There's also an absolute maximum that is drop dead limit.  There's a gray area in between you can take advantage of since an e-cig is not powered continuously and ratings are stated with respect to continuous loads. 

Current limits are based on heat dissipation so if you exceed them, damage does not occur until the part overheats.  This is not the case with voltage.  When voltage limits are exceed, chips fry pretty much instantaneously at some point above what they can tolerate.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Thearlaich1965 on August 15, 2014, 06:11:04 PM
I think I'm going to give the Raptor a try. I previously built an OKR-T6 and really enjoyed it until I fried it out. I found out why too. When I build a my atties for a mech setup I tend to shoot for about 40 watts. I like the flavor I get at that rating.

I am also struggling through some of this and will also be reading up on circuits since I only studied what the Navy thought I needed to know for working on computer mainframes many years ago. I think it covered much of this but it was for memorization purposes and didn't get much into theory. Also, it was almost 30 years ago and I can forget my own name if I go more than a week without using it.

I recently got a (hopefully) decent soldering station and a good Dremel. A lot has happened since I built the OKR and I have to practically start from scratch.

I'm still not sure if I want to try this circuit out or go with another chip like the OKR for now. I have another thread I need to read through before I decide.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 16, 2014, 12:24:15 AM
20A Master switch?  That's only 20A @ 6v correct?
So a 5A @ 125v switch should be fine since we are running much lower voltage. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on August 16, 2014, 01:43:20 AM
I think I'm going to give the Raptor a try. I previously built an OKR-T6 and really enjoyed it until I fried it out. I found out why too. When I build a my atties for a mech setup I tend to shoot for about 40 watts. I like the flavor I get at that rating.

I am also struggling through some of this and will also be reading up on circuits since I only studied what the Navy thought I needed to know for working on computer mainframes many years ago. I think it covered much of this but it was for memorization purposes and didn't get much into theory. Also, it was almost 30 years ago and I can forget my own name if I go more than a week without using it.

I recently got a (hopefully) decent soldering station and a good Dremel. A lot has happened since I built the OKR and I have to practically start from scratch.

I'm still not sure if I want to try this circuit out or go with another chip like the OKR for now. I have another thread I need to read through before I decide.

Thats strange the OKRT6 will go into shutdown if it cannot acheive the wattage because of load  it just pulses a bit then shuts down, take off the shorted load and it should react normally.  There was something else amiss or a bad regulator :Thinking:

I do it frequently with a 6amp 8060 mix up atomizers and use that unit and it does not fry just pulses then shuts down.   Something else is wrongs there..  Its an awesome over-current "switched" unit it in an overcurrent situation wont fire cause it will hurt itself.  Yep yep..  Now Craig says you over volt that mofo even a little and it will go up in a poof but with 8.4v coming at it thats not an issue..  Check your wiring etc the OKR should be fine..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Thearlaich1965 on August 16, 2014, 09:37:27 AM
Unfortunately it got lost in a recent move. That's cool, I wanted to build a T/10 anyway with 18650s or 26650s instead of 14500s.

I messed up the trimmer and the switch. When I bought the parts for it I got the parts numbers from a thread on ECF. The thread was pretty old and some of the parts were out of stock so I had to improvise.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 17, 2014, 06:21:33 AM
Thank you all for your comments on this post and help finding parts! Here's my box!  :thumbsup: ;cheers; :rockin smiley:

P.S. I actually like that it looks a little "messy", rockin the DIY look ;-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Thearlaich1965 on August 17, 2014, 03:47:40 PM
Looks great. If I build one it would be a bit messier than yours. :beer-toast:


BTW- I think yours looks cook. I don't think it looks like a mess.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: dennis15 on August 17, 2014, 05:51:24 PM
congrats tek on your mod build
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 18, 2014, 07:04:33 PM
Well done, tek.  I don't think it looks messy - it vapes and that is success!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 18, 2014, 07:05:42 PM
I've heard of a few modders who are connecting the pot ground to either pin 3 or pin 10 ground pins instead of the -Trim pin 9.

Was curious about this, as well as why 3 ground pins, so emailed the GE rep.  This is the email...

Hi Cynthia
I received your Inquiry:

Comments: I'm working with Naos Raptor 20A - NSR020A0X43Z - and have a question regarding the 3 ground pins 3, 10, and 9. A continuity check shows that they are all 3 connected, but an ohms check shows that pin 9 (-Trim) has a 1.2 ohm difference between either pin 3 or pin 10, and pin 3 and pin 10 have 0.2 ohm between them. Question is why is this and why 3 ground pins and must Rtrim be connected across -Trim pin and +Trim pin, or can Rtrim be connected across pin 10 or pin 3 and +Trim. I'm wiring according to the datasheet and connecting Rtrim across -Trim and +Trim, but am curious as to the need for 3 ground pins. Thanks, Cynthia

Pin 3 and Pin 10 are true ground pins. Pin 9 Trim – does tie to Grd but thru another component. Tying Rtrim resistor between Rtrim + and Rtrim – is the best way to eliminate any noise issue that maybe picked up in the application from interfering with this reference point.  Also there is always a need for Rtrim to be connected internally in case the external connections are broken they module would not go unstable.

I hope this answers your question
Regard’s
Michael Naglich

What I think the rep means from his last sentence is that if pot ground (or Rtrim if not using a pot) is not connected to -Trim pin 9 and is instead connected to either pin 3 or pin 10 and the pot fails (or the resistor fails if not using a pot), the converter will become unstable.  The converter should default to its low output voltage (0.6v) if the pot fails (as long as the unused outer leg of the pot is tied to ground along with the wiper), so not sure if this is what the rep means by unstable that it won't default to low output voltage, or if it is something else that would make the converter unstable.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: cghildreth on August 20, 2014, 06:34:31 PM
What are people using for the non-rated master switch?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 20, 2014, 06:55:20 PM
Thank you all for your comments on this post and help finding parts! Here's my box!  :thumbsup: ;cheers; :rockin smiley:

P.S. I actually like that it looks a little "messy", rockin the DIY look ;-)

Brother that looks fine, I hope my first one looks that good.  Can you share the info on the clear box and firing button you used?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 20, 2014, 07:05:46 PM
Brother that looks fine, I hope my first one looks that good.  Can you share the info on the clear box and firing button you used?

Sure thing. I got he wrong button though, should have gotten a 16mm but got 19mm instead. I actually love the throw, though its not clicky I enjoy it.

Button: http://ebay.us/ud8h27

Box: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=1591BTCLvirtualkey54600000virtualkey546-1591BTCL
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 20, 2014, 07:15:45 PM
Update to everyone. Been vaping my mod since Sunday, no issues yet. I've tried to fire too high, by accident. Sometimes it throttles me, sometimes it won't even fire. Good to me, don't want any damage done. Right now my batteries just hit 6.8 volts and stopped firing 4.5 on a 0.3 ohm coil (67 watts) but will fire at 3.5 (40 watts). So when the chip senses it can't push it, it won't fire. I've been pushing it anywhere from 70 to 120 watts with no problems, no heating up, no acting funny. Just straight power. Lovin' it!!!



http://instagram.com/p/r7t57WFz3e/
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 20, 2014, 07:29:42 PM
great to hear man, hope it continues to produce for you and I am getting more pumped up by the minute to get one of these.  Thanks for the info!!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 20, 2014, 10:02:00 PM
Can anyone recommend a volt meter for my raptor, preferably one thats in stock and not in china:-).  Doesnt have to be the cheapest one or anything special for that matter, just one that works and has the wires attached already?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 20, 2014, 10:29:06 PM
Can anyone recommend a volt meter for my raptor, preferably one thats in stock and not in china:-).  Doesnt have to be the cheapest one or anything special for that matter, just one that works and has the wires attached already?

I used these :http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=231218591497&alt=web

Disclaimer, this is not the same seller(or it could be) that I used. My purchase history from that time is gone, though these look identical down to the board layout and wiring.

P.S. careful with the leads, they break free easily. I had to swap one after building my box. I protected the leads with a bit of hot glue during the surgery :-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 20, 2014, 11:33:57 PM
Can anyone recommend a volt meter for my raptor, preferably one thats in stock and not in china:-).  Doesnt have to be the cheapest one or anything special for that matter, just one that works and has the wires attached already?

I bought the 3-wire volt meter from Adafruit. I am using a higher resistance pot so I can hit some lower voltages and therefore wanted the greater range offered by their 3-wire volt meter.

EDIT: What are you guys using for fuses? I have seen some posts in here but I haven't settled on one. I'd like to run two parallel 10 amps, the one I have right now is a single 18 amp with a 20s trip time. Not the most ideal for protection :/
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 22, 2014, 11:30:56 PM
Hey everyone I have a quick question about the 2 ground pins.  I plan on using the (hopefully) attached picture of mamu's no idle drain build from the previous page of this thread in reply to someone asking for the nfet wiring diagram.  It's the most newbie friendly diagram Ive seen but  my question or point of confusion is about pins 3 and 10, whats the difference between them, they both say ground?  Is there nothing coming off of pin 3 going to any kind of ground?  I thought the previous diagrams all say to have pin 3 connected to a ground.  For this build the only thing connected to pin 3 is the 4.7k and the caps correct?  Thanks so much for any explanation, every time I feel like I totally understand this I get hung up on something.

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-nfet2.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 23, 2014, 12:36:31 AM
According to the GE rep there is no difference between pins 3 and 10 - both are true ground pins and internally connected with each other.  You can use one or the other or you can mix ground connections between the two.  The only thing I wire to pin 3 is one leg of the caps and one leg of the resistor and all other ground connections to pin 10 because it's easy for me to wire that way.  It's your option.

In my original diagram I show pin 3 and pin 10 externally connected with all the other ground wires at a central location.  Since pins 3 and 10 are both true ground pins according to the GE rep and internally connected there's really no reason to externally connect them.  It won't make any difference if you do or you don't, but if you don't externally connect them you have to connect one or the other to the batt - contact.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 23, 2014, 02:57:59 AM
The diagram for the nfet shows the zener connecting to both the Vin and On/Off pins. Is this correct?    And a 47k resistor between S and G pins on nfet as well?
Just got all my parts in and will be wiring it up this weekend.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jrweber02 on August 23, 2014, 09:19:25 AM
The diagram for the nfet shows the zener connecting to both the Vin and On/Off pins. Is this correct?    And a 47k resistor between S and G pins on nfet as well?
Just got all my parts in and will be wiring it up this weekend.

I think mamu goofed on that one or at least when I tryed to use the zener connected in that manner it would cut  not allow any out put butbi switch it to one leg on the on off to the other leg to the  vin  hope that helps its early lmao
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on August 23, 2014, 10:53:29 AM
yup - I did an oops with placing the legs of the zener. 

Corrected...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-nfet3.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bob salter on August 23, 2014, 11:02:26 AM
Would this lipo be good for this build? http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__20390__Turnigy_nano_tech_2200mah_2S_40_80C_Lipo_Pack_TRA2820_Traxxas_1_16_models_.html (http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__20390__Turnigy_nano_tech_2200mah_2S_40_80C_Lipo_Pack_TRA2820_Traxxas_1_16_models_.html)

Bob
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 23, 2014, 11:17:10 AM
Ok thanks Mamu.  Gotta hope radioshack has a 47k resistor.  I only have 200's and 4.7k's
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on August 23, 2014, 11:26:27 AM
Ok thanks Mamu.  Gotta hope radioshack has a 47k resistor.  I only have 200's and 4.7k's

I used a 4.7k, not 47k. Some confusion there?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 23, 2014, 04:12:56 PM
No he is talking about the no idle build that takes both.  Hey was wondering what type of solder do you all use to build these mods?  I have some old "60/40 clear flux solder .063" and some "60/40 rosin core solder .032" so are either of those ideal for these types of aplications or is there something better I could pick up?  Thanks
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on August 23, 2014, 06:14:36 PM
You should use 60/40 or 63/37 tin/lead rosin core solder for electronics.  The gauge is not critical, but it's easier to do smaller joints with smaller gauge solder.  For wires, anything between .015" and .050" should be fine. I don't know what you mean by "clear flux", but there are several of types of rosin core solder and any of those will work fine.

It's possible to use a lead free solder, but the stuff is harder to work with.  Unless there's an issue with lead toxicity (like inside an atomizer), the tin/lead stuff is ideal.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 23, 2014, 06:24:03 PM
First box is on the books!! Thanks to everyone, especially mamu! I am absolutely thrilled that it works. It is not nearly as clean as I'd like on the inside, but I guess I will get better at that after I build a few. Other than that, I am ecstatic! Love the way the box came out as a whole and everything works! Woohoo!

(https://i.imgur.com/8K85PRw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/zs3ccFq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 23, 2014, 06:47:15 PM
You should use 60/40 or 63/37 tin/lead rosin core solder for electronics.  The gauge is not critical, but it's easier to do smaller joints with smaller gauge solder.  For wires, anything between .015" and .050" should be fine. I don't know what you mean by "clear flux", but there are several of types of rosin core solder and any of those will work fine.

It's possible to use a lead free solder, but the stuff is harder to work with.  Unless there's an issue with lead toxicity (like inside an atomizer), the tin/lead stuff is ideal.

Oh perfect so I'll just use the 60/40 rosin core that I have.  The other roll says "60/40 clear flux solder" and to be honest I have no idea what it was originally bought for. 

@Karadorde congratz on that beauty, really digging that sort of speckled pattern on the casing
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 23, 2014, 06:49:00 PM
Josh, much appreciated it. Its a textured finish. Picked up a can of it for a few bucks at Home Depot today. Of course, I jumped the gun and didn't let it dry all the way. Already marred it up on the back a little bit. Got too excited to get it up and running. :(
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: LeeM on August 23, 2014, 06:51:14 PM
love that potentiometer, any part numbers or anything?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 23, 2014, 06:55:41 PM
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/P16SNP471MAB15/P16SNP-470-ND/3430484

It's a 470 ohm pot. So that puts you somewhere around 2.0 - 6.0 volts with the 220 res in series.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on August 23, 2014, 07:00:21 PM
First box is on the books!! Thanks to everyone, especially mamu! I am absolutely thrilled that it works. It is not nearly as clean as I'd like on the inside, but I guess I will get better at that after I build a few. Other than that, I am ecstatic! Love the way the box came out as a whole and everything works! Woohoo!

Nice work. Well done. The inside is not bad.
Each new mod will be better than the last.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bob salter on August 24, 2014, 10:33:08 AM
Would this lipo be good for this build? http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__20390__Turnigy_nano_tech_2200mah_2S_40_80C_Lipo_Pack_TRA2820_Traxxas_1_16_models_.html (http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__20390__Turnigy_nano_tech_2200mah_2S_40_80C_Lipo_Pack_TRA2820_Traxxas_1_16_models_.html)

Bob

ANyone?  Also best charger for them?

Bob
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on August 24, 2014, 10:58:32 AM
bob salter: the batteries are fine to use.
Here is one of many chargers that you can use ---> http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__41635__iMAX_B6_Compact_50W_5A_Automatic_Balance_Charger_2_6S_Lipoly.html


 If you're using non-removable cells, they may likely be the 2S LiPos and those come already wired up with the balance charging plug.  You just mount the plug in the mod so it's accessible then use the appropriate cable.  Hobby King has balance chargers and cables with great prices.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bob salter on August 24, 2014, 12:16:49 PM
Brilliant thank you. Good god postage was gonna be 22gbp. Doh: Sod it I will go to the local rc shop tomorrow and see if they can help.

Bob
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 24, 2014, 03:59:46 PM
Nice work. Well done. The inside is not bad.
Each new mod will be better than the last.

Thanks, Break!! Much appreciated kind words. Can't wait to build the next one.

Brilliant thank you. Good god postage was gonna be 22gbp. Doh: Sod it I will go to the local rc shop tomorrow and see if they can help.

Bob

Damn, I wish those were just a hair smaller. Now I am wondering about wiring some of those in parallel. That voltage and milliamp hours in a 1590 with one of mamu's builds. Yes please.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 24, 2014, 11:19:30 PM
Is 18awg copper stranded safe to use for this build at or near max power?  The awg charts are starting to confuse me and thats what I planned on using
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 25, 2014, 01:13:49 AM
I used 18 AWG stranded for all of my load carrying lines. Everything else I ran with 22 AWG stranded.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on August 25, 2014, 04:12:08 PM
Ok good, and I know I wont be vaping the raptor anywhere near max power, pretty much ever but I certainly want to have the option to do so safely.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on August 26, 2014, 07:31:11 PM
CAN ANYONE TELL ME HOW EXACTLY WIRE THE 2x22uf CAPACITORS IN PARALLEL AND ATTACH THEM TO THE RAPTOR CHIP.  A DIAGRAM OR PICTURE WPOULD BE OF GREAT HELP.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 26, 2014, 07:36:10 PM
Check out this Dustin Brown Video. This gave me an idea of how to do it and I tweaked it a bit to best suit my build. http://youtu.be/8h0eO5DgOxo?list=UUVdA4_-CiiA8KVHy8oa9Gcg
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on August 27, 2014, 02:21:30 AM
Are there any dangers to using a .24 ohm coil on the raptor so long as I stay under 20 amps?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 27, 2014, 08:50:35 AM
.24 ohms of resistance at max amperage output of the board (20A) is 4.6 volts. So as long as you don't exceed that, you /should/ be fine.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on August 31, 2014, 04:07:00 PM
ok, since Breaktru sent me in this direction for my second build, (first was the okrt10) could one of ya check out my parts list? I didn't include the master kill switch, v-meter and rated spdp for it. if you could point me in the right direction for the switches it would be much appreciated. ( i can get the v-meter)

http://www.digikey.com/short/7cznfn
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jomurp on August 31, 2014, 04:44:32 PM
ok, since Breaktru sent me in this direction for my second build, (first was the okrt10) could one of ya check out my parts list? I didn't include the master kill switch, v-meter and rated spdp for it. if you could point me in the right direction for the switches it would be much appreciated. ( i can get the v-meter)

http://www.digikey.com/short/7cznfn

Might I make a suggestion? Avoid the BK battery holder. Go with the Keystone.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on August 31, 2014, 05:38:05 PM
Thier oos. I plan on changing the contacts out to some solit copper ones after I get them. Using 18 g wire I got on hand. But thank u for the advise.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 31, 2014, 05:41:17 PM
Curious what the TL431 is for.

Also, I used the MPD battery holder with no issue. A little tweaking of the contacts and sled and they work perfectly.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on August 31, 2014, 05:43:34 PM
You're going to have a hard time fitting all of that into a 1590G for your first build. Go with 1590B so you have some more room.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on August 31, 2014, 05:45:16 PM
Thier oos. I plan on changing the contacts out to some solit copper ones after I get them. Using 18 g wire I got on hand. But thank u for the advise.

Copper is not a proper spring material

Keystone holders have the lowest resistance, post showing test results: http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php?topic=1226.0
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on August 31, 2014, 05:51:16 PM
Curious what the TL431 is for.

Also, I used the MPD battery holder with no issue. A little tweaking of the contacts and sled and they work perfectly.

the tl431 and related resisters are for a low batter indicator.  You can find the related post on the mod page by breaktru.
You're going to have a hard time fitting all of that into a 1590G for your first build. Go with 1590B so you have some more room.
I also have a 1590B box and a BIG damn pipe mod to play with. As for Copper not being proper spring material, I agree its not all that springy. With a litter rework tho i can put in flat contacts. should work just fine.  I just dont really know what switches to go with. Cant seem to deside on one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on August 31, 2014, 05:53:08 PM
I didn't look but in guessing a sort of voltage divider using the tl431 as a reference. I like it.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on August 31, 2014, 05:58:06 PM
I used the schematic from Electronics-DIY.com and revised it for one LED and for two 3.7 cells. Will indicate at 6.0v.
Use 1% resistors. 1/8 watts is fine. The components can be wired tightly together as shown in the Elect. DIY photo except there will be one LED not two and one more resistor.
See the attached photo (only viewable to logged on members).

I have it also revised it for a single 3.7v cell and low voltage indicates at 3.0v but need to tweak it for a brighter LED illumination.
It's not as easy as I thought. Changing the resistor for the LED will also effect the Adjustable precision shunt regulator (TL431) from turning on. The Ref pin requires 2.5v to turn on.

The attached schematics show an ON-Semi diode. Pin numbers vary on manufacture so check your manufactures datasheet.
See --> DETAILS (http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,804.msg10499.html#msg10499)

**I am happy to share info with all that drop by this forum. So dropping a mention when you post your mod elsewhere would be a decent gesture.
Show your support by signing up as a member and please participate by posting**

i like  the idea of having a light come on to tell me when its time to charge em up.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on August 31, 2014, 06:00:13 PM
On-off-on for voltmeter:

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GPTS203312B/CW183-ND/3190594
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Grayhill/48ASSP3S1M2RBT/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtHXLepoqNyVVRVQihvRYkcot2uKlh3h9k%3d
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK-Components/1103M2S3CQE2/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtHXLepoqNyVW7E3ZN7KLOfxTr%252bmBVmt2k%3d

on-on (use as an on-off) and off-on (only to disconnect fire switch. do not use as a master switch, neither are rated for full current load):
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=1103M2S3CQE2virtualkey61170000virtualkey611-1103M2S3CQE2
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/GPTS203211B/CW181-ND/3190590

are you using the n-fet to pair with an on-off to use as a master switch?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on August 31, 2014, 07:06:35 PM
the n-fet is for a non-rated master switch and stops the low v power drain from the chip. (thats as i understand it).
 :laughing:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bob salter on September 01, 2014, 06:04:57 AM
My thanks to everyone for all the information here. Finished the first raptor mod. Am going to make the arduino okl2 t20 next, then back to more raptors.

Thanks again
Bob

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: El Zipster on September 01, 2014, 11:09:29 AM
Hi to everyone, Ist post here, must say I've learned a lot in a few of weeks of lurking   ;cheers;
Just finished my Raptor 120 and have run into a small snag.
Everything is fine and it's vaping, but..... I have a problem with the pot and could use some advice to rectify it. I'm getting 3.4v at the bottom end and only 3.9v at the top end, any ideas? I.m using 1/4watt 220ohm resistor on a bourns 200 ohm, 0.5watt pot, and wired as per Mamu's schematic.
Cheers
Zip
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on September 01, 2014, 12:17:47 PM
Hi El Zipser, glad that your came out of lurking mode and into posting mode  :laughing:

Double check the fixed resistor value. Make sure it is actually 220 ohms. The fixed resistor and the pot zeroed should give you the 6V.
Also check that you wired your fixed resistor in series w/ the pot between Trim + and Trim - and not to gnd.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: El Zipster on September 01, 2014, 03:24:40 PM
Thanks Breakthru
I'll have me a lookie  :)
Cheers
Zip
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: El Zipster on September 01, 2014, 04:57:24 PM
Problem solved  :cheesy:
Turns out I mounted the shim on the pcb mounting board to close to the pot wheel therefore restriction full movement, Doh!
Cheers
Zip
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on September 01, 2014, 05:17:33 PM
Glad it was as simple as that.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 03, 2014, 07:44:37 PM
Problem solved  :cheesy:
Turns out I mounted the shim on the pcb mounting board to close to the pot wheel therefore restriction full movement, Doh!
Cheers
Zip

I had a doh moment as well when I got a okr box mod and after using it for several days found it underwhelming, even left a review stating I wished it had more power.  One morning I was braking in a new build and used a mini screwdriver to max out my pot back to my normal full power and realized there was a stiff spot at about 60% power which all along I had thought was max power because I was being super gentle with the pot.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on September 03, 2014, 11:13:44 PM
I had a doh moment as well when I got a okr box mod and after using it for several days found it underwhelming, even left a review stating I wished it had more power.  One morning I was braking in a new build and used a mini screwdriver to max out my pot back to my normal full power and realized there was a stiff spot at about 60% power which all along I had thought was max power because I was being super gentle with the pot.

Cannot imagine the smile on your faces when you two sorted those pot issues-- a true  whoa moment..  freaked_out:

They are some powerful modz,  the raptor is stupid powerful..
Whats wild is the commercial industry turn to quad coils needing huge watts 30+ in the new turbo atomizers;  its a whole nother level of vaping starting..
busardo just did a review of a kanger aerotank turbo, it chucks enormous amounts of vapor.  It still needs a few teaks but when they get er dun it will be a norm for many non coilers vapers usig high watt device to use as a topper.   
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 04, 2014, 10:19:29 PM
Hey everyone, was wondering if I could get some ideas on how to make my 510 look a little more flush on a hammond 1590b without a dremel or beltsander.  I dont think the ole dental floss is gonna cut it on this one :-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mmilby on September 10, 2014, 05:44:45 PM
Does anyone have a part number i can go off of for the PFET? I'm having trouble picking out one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on September 10, 2014, 05:46:00 PM
SUP75P03-07-E3-ND (http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=156463165&uq=635459643351833315)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bob salter on September 12, 2014, 09:16:25 AM
Just troubleshooting this build. I have used the raptor wiring for the switch along with the fet for no idle current. When I press the switch the board is getting power on pin two, but the board isnt firing. I originally had v+ sense connected to Vin rather than Vout. Am I likely to have cooked the board? I doubt it as nothing got hot or smoked. I have now moved the V+sense to Vout but the board wont fire. Any ideas before I try swapping out the board?

Bob
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 12, 2014, 08:17:09 PM
ok so I have everything soldered together outside the box and would like to test as many things as possible before putting batteries in.  Is there anyhting I can do with a multimeter to make sure my connections are good and make sure I didnt destroy any parts when soldering?  I heard resistors are very sensitive to heat so id love to make sure everythings is safe, or as many things as possible to try and avoid "frying" stuff.  what sort of things could I test for safety, if any? Thanks so much!!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on September 13, 2014, 09:57:28 AM
Resistors are actually pretty tough.  The most delicate thing heat wise is going to be the circuit board and any components on it close to solder points.  If you're using a temperature regulated soldering iron, it's pretty unlikely you would overheat something unless you resolder it several times or take an unusually long time to complete a joint.

You can check your connections with you multi-meter's ohmmeter by applying the probes end to end.  You probably won't see a poor solder connection with it, but it will give you some peace of mind if they all ring out okay.  You can also check your input and output voltages, ideally if you can rig a load on it and fire it up.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: collinl on September 13, 2014, 06:13:10 PM
Hey all, I was wondering if someone could explain the purpose of the 4.7k pulldown resistor and the math behind it. Thanks!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 15, 2014, 04:46:03 PM
hi again all,

I finally got my board in, which was the last of my parts, on Thursday. I started work on it Friday evening after work, and I soldered the last wire and put the batteries in on Sunday afternoon. At first everything was looking good. I flipped the master switch and the voltmeter lit up with 8.42 volts. With no load, I switched the mini-slide switch to Vout, hit the fire button, and it showed 4.6x volts (fluctuating).

Trouble begins:
The adjustment of the pot does not translate to a change in Vout.
When I put the atty on and hit the fire button, nothing happens... no voltage display on the DM and no vape.
I pulled out the DMM and started poking around. There is 8 volts at Vin and 1-3 volts on anything that's not directly connected to the input 8V. When I hit the fire switch the 4.6x volts exits Vout and goes to the 510, but only when there is no load. When there is a load the output voltage does not change.

I'm at work right now, so I can't check anything until I get home this evening.

Should there be a 1.xx volt current at Vout when the fire button is open, or is that indication of a short?

Why would the pot not adjust the output voltage?

I'm attaching a schematic I pieced together from Mamu's just to show how I have mine hooked up. This schematic is only for the purpose of showing you all what I have going on, and won't be used anywhere else, in case anyone is wondering. I put this together sitting here at work, so if something looks screwy, I may have messed up the schematic. I quickly looked over everything again, and I think it's right, but I'll look at everything again once I get home.


(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/MySchematic_zpsf8adc0c9.png)


Any ideas? I'm kind of at a loss....and on the verge of pulling everything out and starting over.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 15, 2014, 07:43:01 PM
So I ran into what I think is an issue but I wanted to get some feedback on it.  I got the pot thats pictured below and when I was going to mount it (epoxy it to inside of METAL case) I just realized that the metal connections are exposed and exactly where it was to sit flush.  I'm trying to figure out what to do here, I thought to just cover it with a small piece of electrical tape and then epoxy but Im just picturing the tape unsticking as soon as pressure is put on it from above.  Will coating the exposed pieces with liquid electrical tape and then epoxying it be safe and durable?  Should I get another pot?  What would you do?  Thanks
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e20/traetenderjoshleeman/IMG_0985_zps3220e644.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: michamer on September 15, 2014, 08:01:58 PM
So I ran into what I think is an issue but I wanted to get some feedback on it.  I got the pot thats pictured below and when I was going to mount it (epoxy it to inside of METAL case) I just realized that the metal connections are exposed and exactly where it was to sit flush.  I'm trying to figure out what to do here, I thought to just cover it with a small piece of electrical tape and then epoxy but Im just picturing the tape unsticking as soon as pressure is put on it from above.  Will coating the exposed pieces with liquid electrical tape and then epoxying it be safe and durable?  Should I get another pot?  What would you do?  Thanks
Is that a pot that has a removable shaft that inserts in the middle? If so, can the shaft be inserted on the opposite side?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 16, 2014, 08:10:58 PM
It's alive!!! Lol

I was racking my brain trying to figure out what was going wrong. Since it was working fine (other than the pot not adjusting Vout) until I put the atty on, I decided to check the ground coming off the atty where it ties into the other grounds. It was loose. I soldered it up, and viola... everything works fine, pot and all. I will post some pics shortly. I still have to install my magnets. I just wanted to let it be known that she is in working condition. Cheers!! :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on September 17, 2014, 08:33:45 AM
I decided to check the ground coming off the atty where it ties into the other grounds. It was loose. I soldered it up, and viola... everything works fine, pot and all.

Nice troubleshooting  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 17, 2014, 11:20:26 AM
Thanks man. I was so relieved when I pulled that shrink wrap back and that wire was loose. I looked over at my gf and said, "I think I found it!!" I soldered it up, flipped the master switch, and hit the fire button. The DM lit up with the correct voltage, and I squealed like a school girl (not really... or at least I hope not). Anywho....

I think it looks pretty good considering it's my first build. My cuts look like crap around the DM, and I should've just waited for a bezel to come in, but it's just a prototype. There is too much wire, and it's packed in there like sardines in a can, but it works great. I am looking for a new pot and knob, because mine looks like crap. I don't know if you can tell from the pictures, but it's just a thumbwheel pot sitting in a sloppily cut hole. All of my future builds will have the mosfet(s) for safety. I hastily ordered my parts for this build, and when I sat down to start this thing, I realized I had the wrong one. I was just ready to get this thing put together. It's just for me, and just for the learning experience.

I think my next build will be the PTR08100W that I ordered based on your suggestion, breaktru. I'm already looking at painted boxes from pedalpartsplus.com (http://pedalpartsplus.com), colored knobs, and bezels. I have the majority of the parts laying around, and I'm working on a schematic. I haven't found one online, so I downloaded the datasheet, and started drawing one up. It's not finished yet, and I'll post it for you guys to look over when I think it's done, and before I start building.

Now on to the good stuff:

(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/IMG_20140917_083339_zpsf8701876.jpg)

(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/IMG_20140917_083313_zpsaec2dfaa.jpg)

(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/IMG_20140917_083220_zpsf8111b80.jpg)

(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/IMG_20140917_083159_zps6a75bbdb.jpg)

This monster master switch.... I've gotta find a smaller one for future builds for sure.
(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h186/Snypercell/Raptor%20120W/IMG_20140917_083147_zps8755128e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on September 17, 2014, 01:08:11 PM
Congrats on your mod. Looks real cool  :beer-toast:
Each new mod will be easier and better.
Suggestion for the next: keep heavy current wires as short as possible. Example: battery and output.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 17, 2014, 01:59:36 PM
Thanks, and I will definitely keep that in mind.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on September 17, 2014, 02:58:52 PM
Its beautiful Bama thats gittin er dun.

Your gonna like the 08100 evercool mod but IMO its not on the same level of smooth as a raptor.
Still leaps and bounds above 99% of industry batt mods.  Its vicious like a mack truck lol..  The raptor is like a bentley  :thumbsup:

I was vaping an ego twist at 4.8v used it for 4 months then made an evercool and set it to 4.8v I coughed so hard whoa now thats some power were my thoughts.  :laughing2:   Surprisingly uber powerful  these hobby mods are. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 17, 2014, 06:37:32 PM
@ bamanerd  Hell of a first build, I went with this pot based on a recommendation 531-PT10MV-200 which is kinda a pain to mount but its cool because you only need a small hole for the shaft which will make a perfect mount for any kind of dial,knob, ect that you put onto it.  I have a question about the box you used, is it plastic?  Does it have the "hammond tilt" that the alum boxes have?  Whats the part number or model name for it?  Thanks and good luck on your next one.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on September 17, 2014, 07:52:15 PM
Well done, bamanerd!

If you're already planning your next project, you got bit by the bug - lol the modding bug that is.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 17, 2014, 11:07:51 PM
Thanks everyone.

Hahaha Visus, this thing is smooth. I'm loving it. What I'm really loving is the battery life coming from a mech mod. I'm really thinking of putting the TI board in a 1590G. I have huge hands, so the 1590B isn't bad at all for me, but I would like something a little smaller.

Josh, Thanks man. This box is a Hammond 1591BSBK. It's ABS plastic, and it's the same size as a 1590B. I got this one from Parts Express for a whopping 4 bucks. You can't beat that. I've never built with an aluminum box, so I don't know what you mean by the "Hammond Tilt." I did notice that the interior is just a fraction tighter, simply because the screw posts aren't machined out of the corners like an aluminum box. They are actual posts, and I did some grinding and cutting on them with the dremel to get everything seated nicely.

Thank you Mamu. I know for sure that I've been bitten, lol. I daydream about boxes, parts, colors, and wiring all day. I'm going to take a couple days off first, though. I'm always immersed in something like this, whether it be coding Android, mixing juices, building coils, or whatever has my attention at the moment. I need a breather. A couple evenings to relax. Yeah.... right.... who am I kidding? I'll be drawing a schematic before the night is over! lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 18, 2014, 10:43:09 PM
oh wow that is cheap, 3.51 at digikey, def gettin one of those for next build, metal boxes just creep me out a bit.  The hammond metal boxes outer radius is slightly bigger on the open side than the closed side so when you look at the atty it has a lean because of it, obviously the bigger boxes are more noticeable than the G.  Its easy to fix with a sander but I bought a colored box so it would either look horribly finished, color wise, or the atty lean.  Its my first one so I'll be happy if the thing freaking works, I'll be much more anal about my second box i'm sure.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on September 22, 2014, 04:23:11 PM
can i use a polyester-film 22uf capacitor instead of the Multilayer Ceramic Capacitors in the mouser parts list?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 22, 2014, 10:02:26 PM
I used these 581-TAP226K016CRW and they work just fine, easy to mount as well. 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: _tek_ on September 22, 2014, 10:08:27 PM
Sorry if already mentioned, but I'm digging the knives on the potentiometers everyone is using! Got a PN? Mine is giving me fits.

Nice builds everyone!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 23, 2014, 11:50:02 AM
oh wow that is cheap, 3.51 at digikey, def gettin one of those for next build, metal boxes just creep me out a bit.  The hammond metal boxes outer radius is slightly bigger on the open side than the closed side so when you look at the atty it has a lean because of it, obviously the bigger boxes are more noticeable than the G.  Its easy to fix with a sander but I bought a colored box so it would either look horribly finished, color wise, or the atty lean.  Its my first one so I'll be happy if the thing freaking works, I'll be much more anal about my second box i'm sure.

Tell be about it. For a first box, I think the plastic is the way to go anyway. I mean, you don't have to worry about a bare wire hitting the box and shorting, if a wire comes loose or from packing it all in there too tightly. I think the plastic is probably a little easier to work with, especially if you don't have a dremel or equivalent. And the price..... once you get used to building and everything is going smoothly, consistently, then a nicer painted metal box would be great. If you eff something up on a $4 box, it's much easier to toss it and grab another, than it is to toss a $14 box.

I've though about painting the plastic box, or a plastic box (maybe not the one I'm currently vaping on) with spray on bedliner from Lowe's or Walmart. It's 7 bucks a can, and it is great stuff. I started using it on my adventure bike. I ride a KLR650, and I've painted many different parts on that thing, including the plastics, with black bedliner. The stuff is tough as nails, it looks good, it's pretty easy to spray on evenly, and it gives it a nice grippy feel. My buddy used it on his plastic fender flares on his Jeep. The stuff looks good, if you like flat black, which I do. Put a couple coats on there after you've made all of your cuts, and that stuff will last longer than the electronics in it. If/when I do this to a box, I'll be sure to post pics for you guys to see how it looks.

I really hate hearing that about the aluminum Hammond enclosures.... Maybe we should all send them wave of emails :Thinking: lol. All the more reason to use plastic! I do want a metal box, though, so I may just order a bare box, and paint it myself after fixing the "tilt."

Your box will work. I have faith in you  :thumbsup: We all do! Just take your time to make sure your wires are all going where they're supposed to go, and that nothing is going to short. You'll have a beast of a box in no time. I was SO relieved when mine fired up.....after I had to troubleshoot and fix.... yep..... a loose wire.  :wallbash:

So.... good luck man!!! post some pics along the way and/or when she's done.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: scripto23 on September 23, 2014, 04:49:34 PM
I am liking the plastic boxes too. Much easier to work with. I pretty much just use them as a "prototyping" box, then switch to aluminum when I've got everything the way I want it.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on September 23, 2014, 11:33:21 PM
First I did the okr t10, then Breaktru pointed me in the direction of the Raptor. Along the way I did an unregulated box. Thank u to all who have posted to help me understand about caps and resisters and fets. Playing with a dc dc converter is perty fun. The fact that I can vape on it is a bonus. Heres some pics.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on September 24, 2014, 07:41:44 AM
First I did the okr t10, then Breaktru pointed me in the direction of the Raptor. Along the way I did an unregulated box. Thank u to all who have posted to help me understand about caps and resisters and fets. Playing with a dc dc converter is perty fun. The fact that I can vape on it is a bonus. Heres some pics.

Congrats Riqure. Looking good  :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on September 24, 2014, 08:05:44 AM
It  ws alot more difficult than my first build simply because I had to try to fit it in a small box. Not much room left in a 1590g after stuffing it all in there. I didnt like the pot being on the outside and the dm+switch , I didnt trust my cutout skills enough..so there inside too. Man, I  have these threads memorized...from CreigHB posting about caps to Mamu needing a fire extinguisher for her test builds...lol. all in all a good use of my spare time...only one problem. Now all my friends are asking for one...that soulds suspiciously like that dirty word...work. lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on September 24, 2014, 01:06:52 PM
Well done, Rigure!

Point your friends to this thread and tell em that if you can do it they can too and to get to it.  :laughing:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rigure on September 24, 2014, 01:42:38 PM
Ha! Id be happy if I can get my wife to start one...shes still on an ego copper mod I did for her...lol
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: dravell on September 25, 2014, 08:19:51 AM
You used 1590Gs for your first build? Impressive lol...I can say without a doubt on my first box there is absolutely no way I would have been able to build in a G. The work Mamu pulls off in those other small form factors amazes me. Unadulterated skill right there.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 25, 2014, 09:53:42 AM
Unadulterated skill right there.

Most definitely.

Nice work, Rigure. You got a pic of the inside of that 1590G? I'd love to see how you laid it all in there. I'm about to order a few boxes, and I haven't really decided on the numbers yet. I know I want at least one 1590G.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 25, 2014, 10:04:54 AM
Hey Breaktru, and Craig if you're listening, where's a good place to get some custom PCBs? I know I've read Craig talking about it, but I can't seem to find those posts right now. I really want to use boards for my next build(s). I have some Radio Shack PCBs, but they're not exactly the layout that I want. I could cut them up and use a handful of jumpers, but that would get big quickly, and I want it as clean and small as possible.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: joshleeman on September 25, 2014, 11:51:35 AM
Ok so Ive been vaping on my raptor for a week now and its working great, first build so I'm very excited.  Anyways I have 2 questions regarding vout that I'm experiencing on my mod.  First off my voltage at 510 is 5.98, what causes it to be below 6?  Is it poor soldering, cheap pot, ect and is that normal?  And the second thing I noticed is as soon as the button is pressed the voltage at the 510 instantly goes to about 6.2ish for not even a full second and then it drops to 5.98 and stays there as long as button is held.  My build is the no idle drain circuit, sense pins wired to vout/grnd pin 1.

For my next build I want to use one of those pv6 illuminated fire button and had a question about how it should be wired using the no idle current drain circuit.  The button has 2 pins for the light and 2 for the switch so from everything I read in relation to installing it on other types of mods, I'm guessing I use the 2 button pins like a normal button and then to power the led I put a 100ohm resistor from one of the button pins to the pos led pin on the switch.  My question is, does it matter which pin I run the resistor from and what should I do for the led neg pin.  I obviously want the light to come on when button is pressed.  Ive read several different things online as to how the button is wired but there all different and none were specific to the no idle drain raptor so I'm kinda stuck.  Thanks everyone!!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 25, 2014, 12:42:52 PM
My question is, does it matter which pin I run the resistor from and what should I do for the led neg pin.

If you want the button to light up only when you press it, I would simply connect the LED's positive post (your resistor) to the output post of the button itself. This is the same as connecting it to the Control Pin, if that would be easier for you. The negative can go to your closest ground point. This way when the button is pressed the LED gets power, and when it's released the power is cut.

I rigged up a 3mm red LED in this same manor on a little mech box that I made. I like to see that red light whenever the fire button is pressed, so that I know when it's firing and when it's not.

I also tied in the vin side of my voltmeter like this, except I tied it to the input side of the button, so that it always has power ready when I select vin with the spdt switch.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on September 25, 2014, 09:15:56 PM
where's a good place to get some custom PCBs?

Osh Park (https://oshpark.com/).  They can take raw Eagle files which has a limited free version that should cover pretty much anything you would want to do.  Otherwise they can take the standard plot files other PCB drawing programs produce (Gerber and Excellon).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on September 25, 2014, 09:29:11 PM
First off my voltage at 510 is 5.98, what causes it to be below 6?  Is it poor soldering, cheap pot, ect and is that normal?

There's several factors involved in the accuracy of output voltage.

Firstly, you can't really go by the voltage you see with no load.  You have to check with the enclosure open or with some kind of adapter that gives you access to the connections while the atomizer is under power.  There can be a big difference in regulation accuracy between loaded and no-load conditions. 

After that, there is some wiring between the regulation point for the converter and the atomizer connector.  There is some voltage drop that occurs there so even if the regulator is regulating to the voltage exactly, you might see some drop in the wiring, though it should not be more than a tenth of a volt.  You can compare voltage readings at the regulator and at the atomizer to see if there's a wiring issue.  Again, this must be under load or the readings will not mean anything (they'll be the same even if there's a weak connection).

Finally, regulators don't regulate perfectly.  There's always some acceptable error.  A quality regulator with keep that under 1% so in that case, a regulation point at 6V should be no less than 5.94V and no greater than 6.06V.  Your readings show the regulator to be within tolerance.

There's one other point with regulation accuracy and that's the "drop-out" of the regualtor.  All regulators have at a least some and the converters tend to have more than the LDO linear regulators.  Drop-out is the amount of input voltage you need greater than output voltage for regulation to be accurate.  Otherwise, regulation voltage falls off with input voltage. 

For a converter with a 1V drop-out (typical), it will not regulate higher than 5V with a 6V input.  That 6 Volts is the input voltage you would see with series cells when they are fully discharged.  For series cells, input voltage ranges from 8.4V fully charged to 6V fully discharged.

Quote
And the second thing I noticed is as soon as the button is pressed the voltage at the 510 instantly goes to about 6.2ish for not even a full second and then it drops to 5.98 and stays there as long as button is held.

It may be the meter doing that, not the mod.  All meters have a settling time for the readings.  Higher quality more expensive meters register correct readings more quickly than inexpensive ones.  If you're using an inexpensive meter, it could jump around quite a bit for a noticeable amount of time before settling on a stable reading.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: texanator on September 26, 2014, 12:18:34 AM
what should I do for the led neg pin.  none were specific to the no idle drain raptor.

This is for the no idle drain raptor design with a p-fet (polarity protection) and n-fet (no-idle drain).

led pos leg + resistor won't matter which pin of the firing switch, but the led neg pin should go to the raptor ground (between the n-fet and raptor). if you connect it to the battery ground, then it will be lit all the time.

well, I guess if the led pos leg is on the nfet side of the firing switch, then you can probably use the battery ground. I'd go with raptor ground just to be sure, can't go wrong there.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on September 26, 2014, 12:42:29 PM
Osh Park (https://oshpark.com/).

Thanks Craig. I'm about to order some misc parts, and I'll have a look at oshpark.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on October 01, 2014, 12:55:23 PM
Suggestion  to Mamu and those w the skill/equipment to do it I added the ceramic caps Directly to the original cap  on-board as if GE had put them there. It saved on space and looks a bit more tidy. It also eked a tiny bit more from the output.


DO NOT DO THIS if you are not skilled at soldering SMD w an iron, you WILL kill the caps at minimum and possibly the board itself.It is NOT as simple as soldering to a pin or wire.

Note I am not putting where as it will be obvious to those who have the skill to do it.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on October 01, 2014, 03:43:28 PM
Thanks for the tip, Madman.

I solder the caps tucked into the side of the inductor so they really don't take up any extra space.

If you look real close in the pic below you'll see that I lined the side and front of the inductor with Kapton tape.  I do this before soldering anything to those pins in that area.  Then I solder the pull-down resistor, then the zener, then the caps to the board.  Nice and tidy.

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/rw2.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on October 01, 2014, 03:51:48 PM
Mamu, did you trim the pins down and solder to what was left or did you desolder the pins entirely and solder wire straight to the board?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on October 01, 2014, 03:55:25 PM
I snipped the pins flush with the edge of the board, tinned with flux and solder, then good to go with wiring.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on October 01, 2014, 03:57:26 PM
That is excellent. I have a spare raptor to test my skills on with something like this and it may make layout and wiring a heck of a lot easier for my next boxes. Many thanks, ma'am.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mmilby on October 01, 2014, 04:06:01 PM
So a few things. Which size magnets are you finding work best with the hammond boxes....like 1590 B. Also with the sleds i get from digikey my flat top batteries are getting ripped up by the contacts. Any solutions? I'm gonna try using button top to see if that works better. I've also tried an array of switches on my boxes. Trying to figure which ones i like best. Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 01, 2014, 04:35:55 PM
I bumped into someone at the local b&m yesterday who has built around 50 boxes. He told me that if you pull the contacts out of the sled and pinch them with a pair of pliers, then stick them back in there, they will be a little nicer to your batteries. I haven't tried this yet, but when I get some more sleds in, I may try it on one.

Mamu- that looks great. I'm definitely going to try to start doing mine like this from now on.

**edit** I'm using 1/4" magnets, and they work great. I don't know what everyone else uses.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: El Zipster on October 01, 2014, 04:47:34 PM
I put a blob of solder on the bottom of each contact, this helps to keep the batteries in good shape.
For magnets I use 6mm by 3mm.
Cheers
Zip
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on October 01, 2014, 04:48:10 PM
I got my magnets from Home Depot. They came in a pack of ten. Perfect size.

Check here for some info on 'tweaking' your battery contacts: https://imgur.com/a/VcX69
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: dravell on October 01, 2014, 07:25:17 PM
Yes pull the contacts out of the sled (in regards to Keystones) and just bend the inner lip inwards, that fixes all battery tearing issues.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madmanmacguyver on October 01, 2014, 07:59:00 PM
Thanks for the tip, Madman.

I solder the caps tucked into the side of the inductor so they really don't take up any extra space.

If you look real close in the pic below you'll see that I lined the side and front of the inductor with Kapton tape.  I do this before soldering anything to those pins in that area.  Then I solder the pull-down resistor, then the zener, then the caps to the board.  Nice and tidy.


NICE that's pretty clean there...
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 05, 2014, 08:35:00 AM
This one is for you Mamu,

First time poster , but been lurking for some time. Killer forum, great folks. Really like it here. So the question I have is in your Raptor Diagram that has both the PFET and Nfet you have one leg of the zenner going to Vin and the other going to on/off then from the Vin you have another wire going to the S on the PFET. I just wanted to verify that this is in fact correct or is it a typo. Also a super noob question but does it mater which side of the zener I connect to either pin, more importantly do zener diodes have + / - sides....Super noob I know but I'm learning tons here and loving ever second.

Thank you in advance and thanx everybody for sharing so much.

Killer Community

Sam
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on October 05, 2014, 11:13:31 AM
The wiring is correct for the no idle current drain circuit.

Yes, it is critical how you place the zener in the circuit - all diodes have a cathode end and an anode end.  The cathode (end with the band or stripe) of the zener is placed toward Vin as shown in the wiring diagram.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on October 05, 2014, 02:19:14 PM
Well, I just finished the Raptor 20A in a 1590G enclosure. What an incredibly frustrating yet fun build. Really made me think about how I laid stuff out and how I ran my wires. I ended up omitting the fuses and the mosfet because for personal use, I did not deem them necessary. I also only wired the voltmeter to display output voltage because that is all I really need. I've already decommissioned the 1590B. Going to figure out something fun to do with it. Here are a couple of quick shots. You can see where I had to crack open the tape on the regulator to add another pull down resistor. The one I implemented didn't do it's job and I was having an autofire issue.

(https://i.imgur.com/VQ1mdXL.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/HK6BNng.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 05, 2014, 02:27:22 PM
Well, I just finished the Raptor 20A in a 1590G enclosure.

Beautimous! Congrats man. Great job at laying it all in there. Very nice.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on October 05, 2014, 06:54:33 PM
Nice job karadorde. Very nice
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 05, 2014, 07:11:39 PM
The wiring is correct for the no idle current drain circuit.

Yes, it is critical how you place the zener in the circuit - all diodes have a cathode end and an anode end.  The cathode (end with the band or stripe) of the zener is placed toward Vin as shown in the wiring diagram.

Mamu,

Thank you very much for clarifying this for me. I read up on zener diodes before I posted which prompted the question and needed the clarification from you. I really appreciate your patience and not flaming me for noob questions. I have made the appropriate corrections. Again thank you everyone for not being trolls and helping out even with the simple questions which I'm sure you have answered before. As soon as I get a few of my own built out and working I will be sure to answer some of the questions as they roll in. This is what promotes a healthy forum / community and you guys are doing it right.

Sam
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on October 05, 2014, 08:13:36 PM
Welcome to the G club, karadorde!  lol I hear ya about frustrating but such a great feeling to do it.  Well done!

Welcome, screwfunk!  Post eye candy when you get er done!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madyicstik on October 06, 2014, 12:10:53 AM
Im trying to fit this in a 1590b box, just wondering which parts i can live with out? Like voltage meter? Master switch?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on October 06, 2014, 08:04:53 AM
As soon as I get a few of my own built out and working I will be sure to answer some of the questions as they roll in. This is what promotes a healthy forum / community and you guys are doing it right.

Sam

Amen to that brother
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madyicstik on October 06, 2014, 09:35:10 AM
You don't have to use an N-FET in order to use a non-rated master switch.  Just insert the master switch between Source of the P-FET and fire switch instead of between the Drain of the P-FET and fuse in the original diagram.  A master switch between Source and fire switch takes advantage of the low current at the on/off control so you don't need a rated master switch.  But there is still idle current drain from on/off control as it doesn't disconnect power so all it does is prevent firing of the atty.

Here's the wiring for the N-FET... the master switch still doesn't disconnect power, but it does eliminate the idle current drain from on/off control plus prevents firing of the atty...
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor-nfet2.png)

i like this diagram. thanks mamu. im going to use this and make sure credits goes to where its due.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: tumbafox on October 06, 2014, 12:16:52 PM
Instead of using a master switch at all, why not simply use a switch cover like you see on airplanes and spaceships to prevent accidental firing like this one: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgrefurl=https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9278&tbnid=ZZCGbE2ZLyuATM:&docid=h8p0aW6ynUQBVM&h=600&w=600
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on October 06, 2014, 12:21:22 PM
Ha, Ha
Cool but maybe annoying to chain vapers
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 06, 2014, 02:26:51 PM
I still like the idea of a master switch just in case something goes wrong, so you can quickly kill power before blowing yourself up  freaked_out: My master switch is HUGE, and I hated working around that thing, but there was no way that I was leaving it out.

I left out the P-fet, at my own risk, because I accidentally ordered the wrong one, and was too anxious to wait for another. As long as I never flip-flop the batteries, alles klar (all is good), but.... the one time I put the batteries in wrong and flip that switch.... there goes my board. I also do not have the N-fet, because I'm not worried about idle current drain. Mine will never sit long enough for that to be a factor. Plus... that's what the master kill switch is for.

As far as the voltmeter, you can absolutely leave that out. I wouldn't want to, but that's just me. I like knowing where I'm vaping, and how much juice is left in my batteries. If you feel comfy not having a voltage readout, by all means. It can also aid in on-the-fly troubleshooting when you don't have a DMM handy.

It's really all up to you, and what you feel comfortable with. Whatever the case, be safe!!! and update us with your progress!

Good luck Mad!! :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madyicstik on October 07, 2014, 01:32:08 PM
i love mouser! parts came in. its build time!!


has anybody used this inline volt metere/ampmeter before??

https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17864__In_Line_Voltage_and_Amperage_Meter.html
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 07, 2014, 01:51:27 PM
Awesome  :thumbsup:
Can't wait to see how it turns out.

I'm by no means a professional, but it appears that meter requires a minimum of 5V to kick on. I don't know about everyone else, but I rarely vape over 5V. I tend to build lower resistance coils, even when I try to build higher, lol. So... idk man. If you try it, let us know.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Madyicstik on October 07, 2014, 01:54:09 PM
will do, i normally vape at .5ohm and 5 volt. i built my selt an okr and it works great.


i tried that meter, and it turned on at 4.2 volts.  i cant wait to get home and start building.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 10, 2014, 10:53:53 AM
How's it coming along, Mad? It's good to hear that the voltmeter comes on closer to 4V. I'm curious if that's across the board, or if each unit is different due to tolerance. I'd like to check it out, so I may order a couple to play with. I'm also curious about how you switch between volts/amperes, or if it just flashes one then the other (or something like that).

I'm itching to get back to building. I've gotta get some things ordered, so I can start back up. I really want to get a little more hi-tech with a build. Like a digital pot with tactile buttons, and a multi-function readout. Something similar to Craig's Powerblok would be nice. http://www.thevapersden.com/index.php?topic=5900.0;prev_next=next#new (http://www.thevapersden.com/index.php?topic=5900.0;prev_next=next#new)
I know that would be much, much more work, and would require much, much more knowledge and skill, but I WANT.... lol

Anywho.... hope it's going well for you and all of the other builders out there. Have a great weekend everyone! It's a long weekend for me due to Columbus day.  :rockin smiley:


**Edit**
So, I was reading the reviews of this volt/ammeter, and I came across two informative comments: a.) The readout is displayed in the following sequence: U, voltage, A, amps.... at apprx 4 sec intervals. b.) The meter displays accurate voltage from 4V, but the ammeter is erratic until the voltage reaches 5+ volts (stated start-up voltage). I hope this helps anyone who has questions about it, as I did.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 15, 2014, 09:02:43 PM
@Mamu

If I wanted to leave the Nfet out and just use the PFET, can I still strap the Zener across vin and on/off like you have in your diagram or do I have to only strap it across ON/OFF. I already set up a bunch of the chips with the never across the Vin and on/off but have decided to skip the NFET. Any help would be appreciated.

Sam
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on October 17, 2014, 06:16:29 PM
@Mamu

If I wanted to leave the Nfet out and just use the PFET, can I still strap the Zener across vin and on/off like you have in your diagram or do I have to only strap it across ON/OFF. I already set up a bunch of the chips with the never across the Vin and on/off but have decided to skip the NFET. Any help would be appreciated.

Sam

With the original diagram, it wouldn't be doable to bypass the fire switch connection and hook the zener straight across from on/off to Vin.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 18, 2014, 02:35:59 AM
Thank you very much. I ended up getting it right and have built my first two boxes using the standard 1590b and kept the pfet and dropped the nfet. Thing works awesmome. I am now building one using perf board and its looking very clean. Ill post pics when done. Mamu, breakthru, and the rest of the group, big thankyou for helping out.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on October 18, 2014, 01:51:31 PM
That's great screwfunk. I can't wait to see how they look.  :popcorn:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: karadorde on October 22, 2014, 01:28:29 AM
Checking in again. Third raptor build. I built this at cost for a manager at a local b&m.

Pretty standard as far as Raptors go. All the bells and whistles minus the fuses and rated master switch. The rocker switch I used only cuts voltage to the fire switch so it doesn't kill the entire circuit.

Some of my components incase anyone is curious:


(https://i.imgur.com/9mhtzp4.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/1dbeBiz.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/lF2eono.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/iHbyHdl.jpg)


Just a note, these pics were right after I soldered my last connection. Just a quick test to check and make sure everything was working. Next steps are epoxy the sled, switch, and voltmeter. Touch up some paint. And throw some insulation on a few connections just for safety's sake.

Thanks for the help to all. I am having a bit too much fun building these.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on October 22, 2014, 06:53:05 AM
Checking in again. Third raptor build. I built this at cost for a manager at a local b&m.

Pretty standard as far as Raptors go. All the bells and whistles minus the fuses and rated master switch. The rocker switch I used only cuts voltage to the fire switch so it doesn't kill the entire circuit.


Fun, ain't it.
Looking good  :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 22, 2014, 06:59:11 AM
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/P16SNP471MAB15/P16SNP-470-ND/3430484

It's a 470 ohm pot. So that puts you somewhere around 2.0 - 6.0 volts with the 220 res in series.

As I am new to this, please bare with me.  Anybody who knows the answer to this, help me out. I noticed you linked a 470 ohm pot, I assumed we could only use the 200 ohm pot. Please explain how I can choose to use a diffrenf rated pot and what I have to do to compensate for its higher rating.... School is in session and I'm ready to learn...... Thank you in advance.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on October 22, 2014, 07:18:48 AM
As I am new to this, please bare with me.  Anybody who knows the answer to this, help me out. I noticed you linked a 470 ohm pot, I assumed we could only use the 200 ohm pot. Please explain how I can choose to use a diffrenf rated pot and what I have to do to compensate for its higher rating.... School is in session and I'm ready to learn...... Thank you in advance.

Always refer to the datasheet when using a component.
Look at page 14 of DATASHEET (http://apps.geindustrial.com/publibrary/checkout/NSR020A0X?TNR=Data%20Sheets|NSR020A0X|generic) , Table 2. Also you will see a formula.
The fixed resistor will give you the top end of your output voltage and the pot maxed plus fixed resistance will give you your low end of your output voltage. Try to keep it to a usable voltage range. Going to low a voltage is useless. You will have a better dial control if kept to a useable range.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 22, 2014, 07:24:51 AM
Also one more thing, here is a pick of my first raptor build. It was a challenge seeing that this is the first time I really solders smaller components or did something like this on a smaller scale. Look forward to building more. I do have the pfet and fuses wrapped up with the raptor . (http://lh5.ggpht.com/-Om6E2r-l4KQ/VEeRMu1HLzI/AAAAAAAABIk/R6_GJvpNPuM/s1280/IMAG1403.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: screwfunk on October 22, 2014, 07:32:50 AM
Breakthru,
awesome info, thankyou very much for pointing that out. That gives me a little more flexibility in choosing a pot.

Things just keep getting better.
Thank you veryuch
screwfunk
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: bamanerd on November 03, 2014, 10:25:25 AM
Well guys... and gal(s), the Raptor is sold out everywhere again, and rather than pay 30 or 40 bucks to some jerk on eBay, I ordered two OKL2-T20's and they came in Saturday, along with everything else I ordered. The chips are much smaller than the Raptor, if you've never seen one, so this should be fun. I should be able to get creative when putting this thing together, as far as which box I use, which pot, button, switches... all that jazz without having to worry about space. Wish me luck!!

I'm going to try to work on one in the evenings this week after work and try to have it done by Friday night or Saturday sometime. I already have this one promised to my best friend (for cash of course  :D ). I will keep my progress updated over on the OKL page, so come check it out.


Side note: I've got this tiny little PTR08100W still, so I'm going to build my gf a mod with it. She's a tiny girl with tiny hands, so I figure I can make her a nice, tiny 55W regulated mod. She wants something round, so I'm open for ideas.... and yes, lol, I know I just opened myself up for cheap shots with that line. I mean a case/tube! Don't be vulgar!! :laughing2: Breaktru's copper mod that he made with this chip/board is really nice. I don't know that a 25 year old girly girl would be that big into straight copper, so we'll see what we can come up with that is "purdy enuff.".

She also doesn't smoke, so she doesn't need something that hits like a freight train. I made her a batch of Strawberry-Banana 0mg nic juice, and she loves it. I gave her my KangerTech Evod VV battery with an Aspire something-or-another (I can't remember now off the top of my head) carto. She wants more flavor (vapor). That juice I made her is by far the best tasting strawberry flavor I've made thus far, so I know she wants to really taste it. Hell... I do too.

Good luck everyone out there building and vape happy!!

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rico on November 29, 2014, 10:23:36 AM
Hi everybody,

This is my first post here and I would like to share the work I did with my first mod box.

This is (yet another) Naos Raptor 20A build that is nothing from spectacular:
- I just grabbed all useful information (thanks everyone) in this forum and applied it on this build.
- The box is a standard Hammond 1590B case.
- The schematic used was one of Mamu's using a single PFET for reverse polarity and use of an unrated switch, thanks a lot Mamu for your great work!

What I wanted special is to have all components hidden into the case (including voltage potentiometer and display) and be shown as nicely as possible when you open the box.
After a bit of thinking I went to a solution with 2 PCBs (these are cutted perfboards with routing using soldered wires):
- the 'display' PCB that would contain:
  * voltage display
  * voltage potentiometer
  * reverse polarity led indication
  * battery/atty voltage switch
- the 'power' PCB that would contain:
  * naos raptor chip
  * the NFET
  * undervoltage protection diode
  * capacitors and resistances
 - the fuses are separate and connected to the power PCB using standard wire
 
I covered the top of the PCBs using black wire tape in order to have something more eye candy ;)

So here are the images :p

The display PCB done (and tested)
(http://i60.tinypic.com/wiqz4m.jpg)

The display PCB bottom side (I know its ugly)
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2805xko.jpg)

The display PCB inside the case with the battery sled, power pcb not populated yet.
(http://i60.tinypic.com/23906c.jpg)

All PCBs done and wired together (tested and worked the first try, so lucky!)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/20a9w6h.jpg)

Finished box from the outside
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2reo46p.jpg)

(http://i58.tinypic.com/2dcigew.jpg)

Finished box from the inside
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2r7lf28.jpg)

It took me a looong time to finish it, most of the problems being to find a place for all the cables below the PCBs.
But it works, and wonderfully: It will be hard for me to go back to mechanical mods with their voltage drop problems.
People are looking at me like strangely in the street but I don't care :D

See ya!

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on November 29, 2014, 10:46:45 AM
Great job laying it all out with the PCB's. Looks fantastic  :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rico on November 29, 2014, 10:55:14 AM
Thank you ;)

Now need to find the courage to build the same again for my brother, LOL.

And also think on a new kind of build for the next ones ;)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: rrtwister on November 29, 2014, 02:05:06 PM
Nice work Rico. Real smart looking
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on November 29, 2014, 06:28:24 PM
Very neat, impressive work! congratulations, Rico!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on November 29, 2014, 06:52:16 PM
You left your empty druggie  bag out
nice work tho

(http://i62.tinypic.com/2reo46p.jpg)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rico on November 30, 2014, 05:35:35 AM
ROTF

Didn't cleaned the table before taking the photos :p
Took it just after the mod was assembled.

I'm using it for 3 weeks now, and loving it.
This Raptor chip is a beast!

I will never use it at max power though, for me 30/35W is more than enough.
I tried once at 50W (5V with a 0.5Ohm dual coil) and this thing is a big fog machine :D, but too hot for my taste.


Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 11, 2015, 10:24:26 AM
Can anyone give me some links to buy the Raptor 20a chip, preferably uk sites please as i need it asap.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rico on January 11, 2015, 04:52:41 PM
Hello,

Digikey UK seem to have them in stock, please look at the address below:
http://www.digikey.co.uk/product-detail/en/NSR020A0X43Z/555-1139-ND/1964566 (http://www.digikey.co.uk/product-detail/en/NSR020A0X43Z/555-1139-ND/1964566)

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on January 11, 2015, 05:16:27 PM
Digikey and mouser both deliver to the UK from the US. Delivery charges are pretty hefty (so it's worth ordering enough to get free delivery if you can), but they get here quickly. You'll need to add VAT to any prices listed too.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 11, 2015, 05:50:26 PM
Going to order them tomorrow, cheers  :D
Btw does anyone know where out there has any step by step instructions or videos to build this exact schematic, would be a great help as need the info for a college project, thanks.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Rico on January 12, 2015, 01:22:22 PM
I personally used this old schematic from Mamu:
(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/raptor7.png)

It does not have the N-fet so is simpler to wire as it has less components.
I removed the master rated  on/off switch and added a small one (unrated) in series with the on/off push button.
The P-FET I used is the SUP75P03: it is legged big component that is easy to solder.

Cheers.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on January 12, 2015, 07:55:50 PM
Going to order them tomorrow, cheers  :D
Btw does anyone know where out there has any step by step instructions or videos to build this exact schematic, would be a great help as need the info for a college project, thanks.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChbLnX8JcsN9bH4BNgJZ6wA/videos

and the following link has some videos on soldering individual components

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVdA4_-CiiA8KVHy8oa9Gcg/videos
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 13, 2015, 05:41:13 AM
Cheers guys, appreciate it  :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 15, 2015, 04:46:53 AM
Hi guys,

Sorry to bother you agin but I'm having trouble figuring out what the difference is between Non-rated fire switch and a Rated fire switch etc. And does it actually make a difference?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 15, 2015, 10:37:38 AM
We say non-rated to mean that you can use any switch you want for the fire switch - there is no amp rating required.

A rated switch would mean that you have to use a switch that has an amp rating at least the max current of the converter.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 15, 2015, 01:05:39 PM
We say non-rated to mean that you can use any switch you want for the fire switch - there is no amp rating required.

A rated switch would mean that you have to use a switch that has an amp rating at least the max current of the converter.

Thanks mamu, i was racking my brain trying to work it out haha.

Could i get some advice from a professional to a newbie?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 15, 2015, 01:12:39 PM
Of course.  me, breaktru, Craig, and others are here to help.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 15, 2015, 01:22:22 PM
Where would you recommend buying the...

N-FET IRLR8743PBF,

P-FET IPD042P03L3 G,

from, bearing in mind i liven the UK?

And would this case be okay to fit in all the components etc.

http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hammond-Manufacturing/1590GBK/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsrGrAVj6eTvc4t%252bXlGtxAky4qS7dcRmqc%3d
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on January 15, 2015, 04:03:34 PM
I'd have thought a 1590G would be a bit of a tight fit. The 1590B is a more popular case for modding. No harm in getting both. If it fits the G then you're quids in and you can use the B for your next project :).
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on January 15, 2015, 07:27:33 PM
jacob - I'm not familiar with uk electronics sites, but does not the uk mouser and uk digikey stock the FETs?  If not you may have to google uk sites for what you need.

Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on January 15, 2015, 08:13:34 PM
I usually buy from Farnell in the UK (minimum order is £20), but raptors only seem to be available from mouser at the moment, so if you're already paying the huge amount of postage for that you might as well pick up everything else you need from them at the same time.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 16, 2015, 03:19:53 PM
Thanks everyone,

I am going to order what i need, this is what I've got could some check if I've got the correct components etc.

Component list links,

1.   Multilayer Ceramic Capacitors- http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=NRhsANhppD9EOZrmEO6PsQ%3d%3d

2.   Resettable Fuses - PPTC 10A- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/TE-Connectivity-Raychem/RGEF1000-1/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsxR%252bBXi4wRUJQ7UO9GV5T33y4HSDnMY3g%3d

3.   Potentiometers 200ohms- http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=yLGXVRudD3qYwZAKWdvdLg%3d%3d

4.   Hammond Manufacturing 1590BCB- http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=Sq9754QpLBgyQ4s%252b2tZ0wA%3d%3d

5.   Cylindrical Battery Contacts, Clips, Holders & Springs 18650 DUAL SM BATTERY HOLDER
- Contact Plating: GOLD 
http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=%2f7TOpeL5Mz5jXkg8vI8Dyw%3d%3d


6.   Cylindrical Battery Contacts, Clips, Holders & Springs 18650 DUAL SM BATTERY HOLDER
-   Contact Plating: TIN- NICKLE
http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=%2f7TOpeL5Mz78b0pqEFIl5w%3d%3d

7.   Trimmer Resistors- Through Hole- http://uk.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=UjOdgN%2fjCTWH6fryvuD2%2fg%3d%3d

8.   MOSFET 30V- IRLR8743PBF- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/International-Rectifier/IRLR8743PBF/?qs=%2fha2pyFaduigbDnOCbQKZ5Mi2%252bw9CicAG71H4eLs2d8rroay5hfpPw%3d%3d

9.   MOSFET P-KANAL-  IPD042P03L3 G- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Infineon/IPD042P03L3-G/?qs=%2fha2pyFadui3aSMw72Ezh7FVGSOsGKgDuZhL%252bdHFzl8EpwmDrNzmag%3d%3d

10.   NAOS-RAPTOR-20A- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/GE-General-Electric/NSR020A0X43Z/?qs=%2fha2pyFaduho882E5EROOkg%252bUWrmQK8cmuhWTEOR8p1%2fPUbihE3WRw%3d%3d

11.   LED Digital Panel Volt Meter - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DC-3-30V-0-36-2-Wire-LED-Digital-Panel-Volt-Meter-Voltage-Voltmeter-Car-Motor-/351026520215?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&var=&hash=item51bacfa097

12.   Metal Film Resistors- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/KOA-Speer/MF1-4DC4R70F/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvJbyh5%2fSz2%2fXu8dD1WI7%252bN

I wasn't sure what the difference between the Gold and Tin- Nickel contact plates for the 18650 DUAL SM BATTERY HOLDERS where, so thought i would ask you lot as you're the professionals haha.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 16, 2015, 06:29:27 PM
Quote
12.   Metal Film Resistors- http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/KOA-Speer/MF1-4DC4R70F/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvJbyh5%2fSz2%2fXu8dD1WI7%252bN

Wrong resistor
4.7k ohms not 4.7ohms 
your  also not listing your set resistor/5.6v zener or you already have it

Quote
11.   LED Digital Panel Volt Meter - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DC-3-30V-0-36-2-Wire-LED-Digital-Panel-Volt-Meter-Voltage-Voltmeter-Car-Motor-/351026520215?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&var=&hash=item51bacfa097

If you dont mind a lil wait you can buy the smaller 3v-30v  version from china for much less £99

The keystone 1048 holder houses the best contacts on the market, tested by Bap do a search for battery contacts and bapgood
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 17, 2015, 07:25:33 AM
This is why i need you lot haha,
i will correct my mistakes and definitely choose the keystone 1048 holder then.

How much of a wait for the china version?
And do you have a link?

Appreciate the support through this journey.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 17, 2015, 03:59:30 PM
Prolly a ~week and half not sure but thats what it takes to get here...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-DC-0-100V-3-Digital-Display-Panel-Motor-Mini-Yellow-Voltage-Voltmeter-New-Q-/251673640887?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item3a98eaffb7
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 18, 2015, 09:42:55 AM
Is this POT okay to buy even though its 220ohms and not 200ohms...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-PCS-Piher-Trimmer-Preset-Potentiometer-220-Ohm-PT10H-/220781521773?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item33679aab6d
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 18, 2015, 02:22:18 PM
I could not tell ya, some pots strip adjustment slot really easy that one looks suspect,  so I would get a knob with it if you can..

The regulator wont go to lowest setting of 3.?v with 220ohm is all..  It will have a very slightly higher bottom end..

If your using mouser best to get it from there
its £50 @ mouser £3.50 ebay..

Your asking weird question spend more £ there, excited are ya?   :laughing2:  :thumbsup:

This pot you can easily adjust with your fingers hidden inside the box its awesome but quickly adjust voltage not so smooth.
http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Bourns/3352T-1-201LF/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvygUB3GLcD7rufck0TIBKy3BWVwyA0FAQ%3d


This pot wont strip and you can make an outside access port hole with smooth voltage adjustments
http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Bourns/3266W-1-201LF/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvygUB3GLcD7rufck0TIBKy8zmW4GJpCV0%3d

Another hard to but can strip pot decently smooth
http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Bourns/3306K-1-201/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvygUB3GLcD7sSg8po3Zpo32ZYTTNIZD6E%3d
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 18, 2015, 02:45:55 PM
Everything ordered now, yes i am very excited to start and interested to see how it turns out, will keep everyone updated if interested.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: hill115side on January 22, 2015, 11:12:30 AM
LPV has been testing and has released this OKL2 110 Watt PCB BASED mod...
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: hyenaboy34 on January 22, 2015, 11:59:24 AM
very nice too bad pre orders are closed. I also like my big honking Potentiometer as well, I never liked the ones Hex Ohm used feels too cheap and they wear out pretty quick. Nice idea and job on their part though, makes it pretty easy for someone to not screw it up and create a grenade :-)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 22, 2015, 03:31:01 PM
Question?
What is the purpose of the 22uf capacitors on the Naos Raptor 20a circuit?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 22, 2015, 04:17:20 PM
By the way what id the lowest setting it will go to in v/w as i know maximum 6 volts but whats the minimum?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on January 22, 2015, 05:38:58 PM
0.69V
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 23, 2015, 09:33:36 AM
Thanks, do you know what the purpose of the 22uf capacitors on the Naos Raptor 20a circuit is?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: doobedoobedo on January 23, 2015, 09:53:52 AM
They help stabilise the input.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 23, 2015, 05:23:46 PM
Those are required input filter capacitors.  The way a buck converter works is it loads the inductor with a high frequency PWM pulse.  So the load is cycling on the battery at a high frequency.  Input capacitors provide the energy to smooth out voltage to keep things stable.  Otherwise input voltage will pulse with loading on the inductor.  Digital electronics can have issue with unstable supply voltage, they hate sudden variations in supply voltage.  The PWM controller on that board is a digital device, they all are.

Most step-down modules provide the input capacitors already on the circuit board.  The Raptor requires you add them yourself.  Some require external caps some don't, just depends on the module.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on January 23, 2015, 05:39:12 PM
Great in-depth explanation Craig, just what i was hoping for,  thanks man.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on January 23, 2015, 05:43:11 PM
welcome :)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on January 23, 2015, 06:03:31 PM
Yeah that made it into memory Craig. 
I knew they stabled input but didn't know why/how at the reg.


 :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on February 01, 2015, 12:21:55 PM
Those are required input filter capacitors.  The way a buck converter works is it loads the inductor with a high frequency PWM pulse.  So the load is cycling on the battery at a high frequency.  Input capacitors provide the energy to smooth out voltage to keep things stable.  Otherwise input voltage will pulse with loading on the inductor.  Digital electronics can have issue with unstable supply voltage, they hate sudden variations in supply voltage.  The PWM controller on that board is a digital device, they all are.

Most step-down modules provide the input capacitors already on the circuit board.  The Raptor requires you add them yourself.  Some require external caps some don't, just depends on the module.

I was wondering, what is the reason that we use 2x22uf capacitors in parallel with each other?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: CraigHB on February 01, 2015, 01:16:18 PM
It halves the "ESR" and doubles the capacitance.  ESR stands for equivalent series resistance and is just what it sounds like, a resistor in series with the capacitor.  All conductors have resistance and capacitors are no different.  Resistance "damps" the effect of the capacitor requiring more capacitance to do the same job.  Ceramic caps have one significant advantage in the they have the lowest ESR, however they are limited in the amount of capacitance value.  Using two 22uF caps in parallel is equal to one 44uF cap and is cheaper than a single 44uF cermic cap.  There's some other reasons to use ceramic arrays over single electrolytics such as size.  Generally it provides the best performance with the least size and reduced cost.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jacobprescott on February 01, 2015, 04:38:17 PM
Thank you again for your very impressive knowledge on the topic, i could and will learn a lot from you guys.

P.S- Sorry i don't know how to delete previous posts...
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on February 21, 2015, 11:48:49 PM
hey all! i hope i get an answer as this thread seems to have been dead for a few months! i'm looking at building a raptor box and i have designed 2 pcbs, based on Rico's design and mamu's latest diagram, to mount the parts in my box and written out a parts list. i was hoping you could check my scematics/shopping list and tell me what you thought. thanks!


pcb design:

(http://s24.postimg.org/3z40y83ud/control_board.jpg)
the control board containing the POT, the Voltage display and the Vin/Vout switch.

(http://s11.postimg.org/nik5bktmr/power_board_design.jpg)
the power board, containing the resistors, the capacitors, the chip, the N-FET and the master switch.

the P-FET will be wired directly to the fire switch.

Shopping list:

chip: NAOS Raptor 20A
link: http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en?vendor=0&keywords=NSR020A0X43Z

510 connector: FDV v4 low profile short
link: http://www.fatdaddyvapes.com/shop.html

fire button: A13040500UX0141
link: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ENUDD0W/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3AZW35WSKZ6W8

master switch: L202011MS02Q
link: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=L202011MS02Qvirtualkey61170000virtualkey611-L202011MS02Q

voltage switch: 1103M2S3CQE2
link: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=1103M2S3CQE2virtualkey61170000virtualkey611-1103M2S3CQE2

Zener diode: 1N5232B-TR
link: http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/1N5232B-TR/1N5232BVSCT-ND/3104346

fuses: RGEF1000
link: http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RGEF1000/RGEF1000HF-ND/5029771

resistors:
   4.7K?: CF14JT4K70CT-ND,
http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=167024790&uq=635601514913109330&CSRT=2607944548175329541
   47K?: CF14JT47K0CT-ND,
http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=167024791&uq=635601514913109330&CSRT=2607944548175329541,
   220?: CF14JT220RCT-ND,
http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=167024788&uq=635601514913109330&CSRT=2607944548175329541

capacitors: TAP226K016CCS
link: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=TAP226K016CCSvirtualkey58110000virtualkey581-TAP226K016CCS

N-FET: IRLB8743PBF-ND
link: http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=167024787&uq=635601514913109330&CSRT=2607944548175329541

P-FET: IPD042P03L3 G
link: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=IPD042P03L3_Gvirtualkey63830000virtualkey726-IPD042P03L3G

potentiometer: 93PR200LF
link: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=93PR200LFvirtualkey57700000virtualkey858-93PR200LF

voltage display: SMAKN® Blue 0.28" Mini 2 Wire DC Voltmeter 2.50~30v
link: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00M50SEYC/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2OCOGC9B25845

case: Hammond 1590B

magnets: Neodymium Magnets 1/4 x 1/8 inch Disc N48
link: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008PGMG58/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2W1NLLA67T8X2

thanks again!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on March 03, 2015, 12:56:42 AM
Figured I'd post my finished box. Not pretty inside but it works great. Been using it for about 6 months now everyday. I've actually worn out the switch to where it doesn't always fire. Will be replacing it this week.

Unmatched batteries were just for testing.
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b130/onefstsnake2/3A5872F8-4B45-4DCA-AD30-8ACC0FEAD222_zpsxnsxjbqx.jpg) (http://s18.photobucket.com/user/onefstsnake2/media/3A5872F8-4B45-4DCA-AD30-8ACC0FEAD222_zpsxnsxjbqx.jpg.html)

Still haven't put magnets in it lol.
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b130/onefstsnake2/BC57524B-E41E-4027-9DE7-13388AED9206_zps5djkp3vk.jpg) (http://s18.photobucket.com/user/onefstsnake2/media/BC57524B-E41E-4027-9DE7-13388AED9206_zps5djkp3vk.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on March 03, 2015, 08:25:32 AM
Figured I'd post my finished box. Not pretty inside but it works great. Been using it for about 6 months now everyday.

Congrats  :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: onefstsnake on March 03, 2015, 10:10:42 AM
Thanks for all the help. The wife wants one now but in a smaller package and less wattage. Maybe a good okr box
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 03, 2015, 04:39:27 PM
Ok, well I'm going to go ahead with this build once my parts get here. If by chance it will not work or is unsafe for some reason I cannot fathom, please, let me know. Nice lookin mods all, btw.
Edit: and here it is!!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 27, 2015, 07:23:26 PM
Hey minamato.  Nice looking mod. Congratulations! ;cheers;

So hows she vape?

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 27, 2015, 07:54:12 PM
 Thanks Wayne! Like a beast. My god. I over nic'd myself in my excitement lol
Although I only get 5.1V under load set at max...too much wire? Also, I wired my pot backwards so 0 is 100. Which is annoying but not critical. Oh well, there's always next time!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 27, 2015, 08:15:15 PM
Glad you're enjoying it! :)

Do keep a close eye on it though. If you are dropping .9 volt under load (assuming the batteries are holding up) that could be up to 18 watts of heat somewhere where you don't want it.  Not trying to alarm you or anything, just want to point out that that voltage has to drop somewhere, and that mean heat.

What is your atomizer resistance when you see this drop? ( you do get a full 6 volts unloaded, right?)

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 27, 2015, 09:09:08 PM
My atty is .3 ohms. I hadn't tested my unloaded voltage until just now but it reads 4.99... And now when I screw my atty back on the chip buzzes if I turn the dial past 75% ( the screen will read around 4.5 V when it doesn't buzz. If it's buzzing the screen just turns off). Could I have a bad voltage meter?
Also, I poked around inside while firing and didn't notice any heat from any of the components...the batteries are brand new.
Thanks for helping me iron out these few remaining wrinkles
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 27, 2015, 09:27:16 PM
Huh.  Well, .3 ohms should be about 80 watts at about 5 volts, so the chip itself should handle that.  If you can't go above about 5 volts unloaded, that's actually a good thing here, it means you aren't actually dropping voltage somewhere along the way.

Of course, you should be able to get 6 volts out, if the select resistance is of a proper value.  Please don't take offense at this question, but how confident are you about your soldering?

Oh, and you might want to check it's behavior with a less taxing load, something over an ohm maybe.

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 27, 2015, 09:47:15 PM
Honestly, not 100% confident that my soldering is awesome. No offence taken. You think I have a loose connection somewhere?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 27, 2015, 10:14:51 PM
Heh. I was micro miniature repair certified in the military many years ago, but that just means I know more ways to screw up.  :laughing2:

Hard to say for sure where (or even how many) potential issues might be lurking here.  If it were me,  I think I would first want to find out why I couldn't get the full 6 volts out without a load applied.  You already said that you had the pot backwards, so maybe disconnect there and check the resistance of the pot and the offset resistor?  Not even familiar with the 20 amp Raptor, but if it's like the 10 amp board, the offset should be 220 ohms max, and the pot should swing from zero to 200 ohms max.

If you can't get it to behave without a load, you can't expect it to improve when loaded.

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 27, 2015, 10:20:16 PM
Alright lol, debugging time it is then. Thanks.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 27, 2015, 10:28:16 PM
No problem, minamato. headed for the bed for now, but I'll check back.

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: minamato on March 30, 2015, 07:34:15 PM
Ok, I think I figured out what it was. My batteries were getting low on charge and the voltage under load was dropping below the cutoff. Does that make sense? I seems to work perfectly with fresh batteries. Except still no 6V only 5.1...haven't really tried to tackle that one because it's more power than I need even at the max I have.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: wa9w00d on March 30, 2015, 07:48:43 PM
Yeah, it does.  I kind of suspected that.  And the 5.1 top isn't an issue as long as there isn't a (large) drop between unloaded and loaded.  About the only thing I would say is that LiPo batteries much prefer being charged often to being drained down (that's my understanding,anyway).

Glad there aren't any real problems.

Wayne
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: eveshka on April 09, 2015, 04:17:29 AM
Another nice build idea.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: spasmenokarabi on April 27, 2015, 06:23:11 AM
I am reading this about Naos Raptor for a few days and I am planning to make one.
The only part that it is not available is d-pack IPD042P03L3G. So, is there any alternative to this? I would prefered one from mouser to keep low the total cost.
Thank you.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on April 27, 2015, 10:42:40 AM
You can use the SUP75P03-07-E3 P-FET which is what I used before switching to the smaller dpak one.  If space is at a premium in your mod and you need the smaller dpak sized P-FET, search for another one that has the same or similar specs as the IPD042P03L3G or SUP75P03-07-E3.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: spasmenokarabi on April 27, 2015, 02:55:40 PM
Thank you for reply.
Can I use the "SPD50P03L G" instead of "IPD042P03L3G"?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on April 28, 2015, 01:22:49 PM
Read the datasheet of the part you're wanting to substitute.  If the specs are the same or similar to IPD042P03L3G, you're good to go.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jblack741 on May 10, 2015, 02:36:41 AM
Hi All,
    This is my first post here and I've been following some of you on ECF and Reddit. I've just completed my third build and have collected the parts needed for a Raptor 120w. I'm not sure if I want to use aluminum or ABS for the box yet and since I have some time to think it over while I put the wiring package together, I like to get some input, also I'm undecided as to whether I want a dual 16650 or 26650. My other boxes, a DNA30, Dual 18650 MosFet and a Dual 26650 OKR T/10 are all aluminum and hydro-dipped. Anyway thanks to you all for the great efforts, work and tinkering that has allowed us/me to be a better modder, safer modder.  :beer-toast:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: vapeviking on June 07, 2015, 06:50:47 AM
I've got all the parts for the no idle drain build but since this is my first raptor build i thought I'd breadboard it first and I've got a problem i can't figure out. When I "fire" it unloaded the v out on the voltmeter shows and changes when I adjust the pot BUT with an att come cred it will not fire at all! Anyone has any idea why this is?
Please help a first time raptor modder.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on June 07, 2015, 02:18:45 PM
Bad 510 connection your maybe shorted there..
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: vapeviking on June 07, 2015, 04:57:56 PM
Bad 510 connection your maybe shorted there..

It's not the 510 unfortunately, I did a basic breadboard without volt display p-fet or n-fet and then it fired.Would it make a difference if I soldered it instead of using long thin breadboard jumpers?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on June 07, 2015, 06:02:08 PM
Breadboards can be the source of failure for connections. And when using heavy amps, it is best to wire directly w/ heavy short wire.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: vapetech334 on September 28, 2015, 12:07:54 PM
Hey guys and gals, this is probably the wrong thread for this , it is very old but it seemed appropriate.
I recently built my 3rd raptor,20a pcb build,, I get my pcbs partially assembled from modpcb.. Ive,done,one with a volt meter and one with a mod meter and they,both worked, perfectly. This,time, I ordered the same parts and followed the same procedure. I just finished,it and when I added the vtc4s,and flipped,the lock switch,it started,firing,, but when I hit the kill switch, it kept going... Popped out a battery to stop,it
 Ive,since tried 3 new momentary,switches,,2 fdv 510s, completely, desoldered and,and did it,again.. Same issue...I'm Woo confused..
macro shots of the entire board. Ignore,the sloppy wiring. I always freewore,and test beflre boxing,it.
Pleaae, help
Link
http://imgur.com/a/NBoSv
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: mamu on June 20, 2016, 04:27:43 AM
Anyone still making Raptor mods?

I took a break from making DNA mods this last year and made a fun 120W 20A Raptor mod - and that def satisfied me for the challenge of the build after the less challenging DNA build.  I found I had actually missed this kind of build - adding caps, POT, resistors, PFET, fuses, etc.  I kid you not lol I def missed it.

Converted a Cobra camo edition walkie talkie to a Raptor 20A, 120W mod with RPP, low voltage cutoff, and modmeter. I dremelled out the triple AA batt sled and inserted a 3D printed black ABS dual 18650 batt sled that I designed to fit in that area of the case. I designed a POT bezel/cradle and printed that in orange ABS - got lucky in that the orange ABS matched the orange buttons and side grips of the case. Also designed and 3D printed a black ABS panel/cradle for the modmeter and inserted that in the screen area of the case so that the screen area not filled by the display is blacked out.  The only feature I kept from the walkie talkie was the flashlight... gotta have a flashlight lol.

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/cobra-all.png)

(http://www.mamumods.com/pics/cobra-4.png)
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on June 20, 2016, 05:32:12 AM
Fantastically done mamu. Great to she you back and modding more challenging builds.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: jeandbean on June 21, 2016, 03:33:58 PM
Great mod manu as usual  :rockin smiley:
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Visus on July 02, 2016, 05:08:50 PM
Woot Mamu thats great. 

I also miss making mods but settled now at 50w max 30w daily vaping,  the off the shelf mods calling me.  Still vaping Ti chip mods and yet to buy an off the shelf but ya,  "they have the cutest mini mods around out now and snazzy looking.."

I had a spur of bad luck,   burned out three 08100 mods in two weeks because no rev bat protection oops..  Custom bat wrap confused me  raged:..
Ok, ok,  it was the wacky tobacky confusional type I got this  :laughing2:..

I did manufact with old atomizers a new mini water atomizer device for the other world of vaping, it would be a huge hit methinks literally  :laughing:.  Meh 
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: Breaktru on July 02, 2016, 05:28:34 PM
I also miss modding the TI boards. Been getting the free beta testing mods and boards from evolv (DNA's).

Visus, how about putting on the battery polarity labels in the mod and also on the batteries. You can print them out from HERE (http://breaktru.com/smf/index.php/topic,1344.msg16503.html#msg16503)
That's what I do.
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: dc99 on July 04, 2016, 05:37:41 PM
Well, I have totally gotton lazy. Been using the boards from here. Have not had any problems with any of them so far.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/app/878031628949465/?sk=app_189977524185
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: SDaddy on July 05, 2016, 01:18:10 PM
Well, I have totally gotton lazy. Been using the boards from here. Have not had any problems with any of them so far.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/app/878031628949465/?sk=app_189977524185

Tried those boards also. Can't get them low enough for the wife to vape on them. If the wife ain't happy......
Although Big Al states he will be lowing the low end output, I'm not sure I'll spend any more money on his brand.

I have the latest PWM that David4500 has let loose on the world and can make all I want!
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: david4500 on July 11, 2016, 10:44:46 PM
Have you had the chance to assemble one of those boards?
Title: Re: Tinkering with the Naos Raptor - 20A, 120W dc/dc converter...
Post by: SDaddy on July 12, 2016, 04:26:45 AM
Have you had the chance to assemble one of those boards?

I have. It's working perfectly. Used it all day today (and still using it now). Seems to be a bit smoother than the DualParaMos V 1.4 although I feel the 6 connection points on the end are a tad too close for those of us that shake a bit now and then when soldering  ;) .  Managed to not to solder any of those points together yesterday and mounted it in a CNC G box with a 1500mAh 2S Lipo, which I will pass off to a friend next weekend. Tomorrow I'll be mounting 2 more sets , one for the wife and one for me.  This board, like most of yours, adjusts low enough for her, and I can mount the board flat, up behind the 510 connection, without issue.