Author Topic: The Spark-O-Matic - Wire Arc Welding for coil making (Read 472935 times)

Breaktru · « **Reply #450 on:** February 11, 2014, 07:24:44 AM »

It's hard to trouble shoot without seeing what you done.
One thing to check is how you wired the 15k bleed down (discharge) resistor and the N/O bleed button switch.

Farnak · « **Reply #451 on:** March 03, 2014, 08:34:20 PM »

Hi all,
First I would like to thank Breaktru for all he has done and shared.
I joined because of the eJuice Me Up software and the need to look for recipes.
Then I stumbled on the Spark-O-Matic! So, I've been gathering parts and reading the threads.
Picked up 10 flash boards on sale at Electronic Goldmine. Dusted off the soldering iron and am going for it.
I have a observation for one of the members But have seen that I must post 3 times before I can attach a photo.
So, please bear with me.

Farnak · « **Reply #452 on:** March 03, 2014, 08:51:24 PM »

Post 2

The boards have a 160uf cap, so pulled one from another board and now have 320uf.
Hooked up some jumpers, connected my DMM, prepped the 32g kanthal, looked for the 32g nickel, couldn't remember where the heck I put it,
so cut the kanthal in half, (what the heck, its only a test run), installed the battery, charged her up to 80 ish volts, watched it bleed slowly down
(semi cheap DMM) and at what I felt was the right moment, touched them together!

Farnak · « **Reply #453 on:** March 03, 2014, 09:16:19 PM »

Post 3

Sudden flash and I once again had 1 piece of kanthal!
An almost perfect butt weld.
Beginners luck for sure, was trying for the over lapping, hands aren't as steady as the once were.
Just noticed I can post a photo.
So
I think I have the same boards as BTO2013 in reply 446
And you can remove quite a bit of the board and still retain the charging circuit.
The points I marked for attaching wires all have a thru hole, so you can have all wires and components on the no trace side.
I used a pair of side cutters and nibbled away the x'd out portions of the board.
Would have posted a real photo of the actual board I tested this on, but I think my camera must be with the nickel wire (sigh).
(don't think the add quote worked, Dang electrons anyhow) LOL

Breaktru · « **Reply #454 on:** March 04, 2014, 07:36:54 AM »

Very good Farnak. Way to go dude.
For my NR wire I use a single strand pulled from some 18ga stranded wire I have. It's plated copper wire, silver in appearance.

vapermd · « **Reply #455 on:** March 17, 2014, 08:38:36 PM »

Any words of wisdom or tips before I attempt this build? I got double the amount of each component in the event I screw up (except the flash board). But I was able to score one from Walmart photo lab for free. So I can always hit up another one for more.

Breaktru · « **Reply #456 on:** March 17, 2014, 09:57:49 PM »

As long as your follow the diagram you should have no problems.
Are you building it with the ohm meter or just the voltmeter?

vapermd · « **Reply #457 on:** March 17, 2014, 10:34:19 PM »

Without a meter at all. The parts store in town only had an analog meter and it was busted. My project box is big enough to add one later though. I have a small $30 multimeter and was thinking about mounting it in the box as well. And probably throw in a 510 connector so I can build on this box too. AND use it for "hot wraps".

vapermd · « **Reply #458 on:** March 17, 2014, 10:41:07 PM »

Had a hard time finding that last capacitor too. Ended up with a 100uF 35V as my 3 rd cap. The guy assured me that it should work considering I'm not charging it to 350V. Did he give me solid info or am I looking at disappointment?

Breaktru · « **Reply #459 on:** March 18, 2014, 07:17:05 AM »

Quote from: vapermd on March 17, 2014, 10:41:07 PM

Had a hard time finding that last capacitor too. Ended up with a 100uF 35V as my 3 rd cap. The guy assured me that it should work considering I'm not charging it to 350V. Did he give me solid info or am I looking at disappointment?

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but "The guy" is mistaken. A rating of 35V is 35V and not 350V.
Go back to Walmart, get another free camera and take out the cap.

vapermd · « **Reply #460 on:** March 18, 2014, 07:58:07 AM »

So I need a total of THREE capacitors off those cameras?

Breaktru · « **Reply #461 on:** March 18, 2014, 09:00:29 AM »

Quote from: vapermd on March 18, 2014, 07:58:07 AM

So I need a total of THREE capacitors off those cameras?

It's not the number of caps but rather the uF total value. As long as you are approximately at 340uF. I find around 340uF works well for me. Not saying that you can't be less or more. The voltage set will need to be adjusted to what uF value you end up with. 340uF @ 74v works good for me.

vapermd · « **Reply #462 on:** March 18, 2014, 09:21:48 AM »

I'm at 340. It's just that last cap is 100uf/35v. I will probably ha e to get another camera board.

Visus · « **Reply #463 on:** March 20, 2014, 02:02:03 AM »

Finally built mine it works like a champ just need an enclosure or not, using it grenade style.

4 second count joins them every time. Its @ 4sec approximately 110v for my board falling fast on my meter.

I had 2 old cameras laying around, so I used them.

Thanks Break

geothee · « **Reply #464 on:** March 20, 2014, 05:36:33 AM »

Quote from: Visus on March 20, 2014, 02:02:03 AM

Finally built mine it works like a champ just need an enclosure or not, using it grenade style.

4 second count joins them every time. Its @ 4sec approximately 110v for my board falling fast on my meter.

I had 2 old cameras laying around, so I used them.

Thanks Break

Congrats Visus

Looking at the photos, I see two caps. Should be now at 320uF. Break says that output voltage should be around 75v with that capacitance but if it's working good for you at 110v then great.

Most likely the falling voltage is due to your meters low impedance.

Visus · « **Reply #465 on:** March 20, 2014, 06:38:24 AM »

The other cap is 150uf so 310uf -- its really cool welding these wires. If only I could get them aligned properly lol I wince every time I get them close.. OMG its gonna shoot me in the eye type feeling.

Visus · « **Reply #466 on:** March 21, 2014, 12:25:11 AM »

Making really good welds @ 3sec with 32ga and 28 ga nichrome. My evod has never been this happy.

Arooooooooooooooooo

I had a pack of dollar store cheapie 8pk aaa batteries sitting for a long while so I use one and my times increased a bit heres me trying to make a weld..
Duracell aa battery 3 secs and golden
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTecP5FMNnA

Farnak · « **Reply #467 on:** March 22, 2014, 12:15:51 PM »

Finally got all the parts crammed into a box. She is working nicely.
I ended up changing the 3PDT to a 4PDT so as to add the Power Off Auto Bleed feature suggested by angah83.

Quote from: angah83 on April 12, 2013, 11:07:28 AM

just thinking of replacing one way on/off switch with SPDT 3 pins switch and add 1K resistor on the off pin side so that it will drain the caps when the switch is in off mode/state. is it plausible/safe?

Knowing myself, I believe this will save me from using one or more of those words that mother told me not to use

Once again thanks to all who have helped.
Now to try building the 44+

Visus · « **Reply #468 on:** March 22, 2014, 07:57:15 PM »

Awesome --

No pics? Farnak

If I used an onboard meter I would put in a drain. I find Breaks ~75v to be on the money,, In my video at about ~7secs hold on my meter its 85v with aaa batts people were saying they had good welds at lower voltages 25v-35v-etc.. --doesn't seem so in my test...
I tap the leads before charging to ring out the residual voltage, amazing how they can sometimes sit at 3-8v without power being applied. Mine gets nominal use maybe once a month so its not as relevant for me.. I was thinking about purchasing an ithaka just so it would have more use.

Breaktru · « **Reply #469 on:** March 22, 2014, 08:29:02 PM »

Quote from: Visus on March 22, 2014, 07:57:15 PM

Awesome --

No pics? Farnak

If I used an onboard meter I would put in a drain. I find Breaks ~75v to be on the money,, In my video at about ~7secs hold on my meter its 85v with aaa batts people were saying they had good welds at lower voltages 25v-35v-etc.. --doesn't seem so in my test...
I tap the leads before charging to ring out the residual voltage, amazing how they can sometimes sit at 3-8v without power being applied. Mine gets nominal use maybe once a month so its not as relevant for me.. I was thinking about purchasing an ithaka just so it would have more use.

If you are using a cheap MM w/ an input impedance of less than 10M you will see a faster voltage drop than using one with 10M or better. Same hold true with panel meters.

The people using 35V are not using camera boards. They are using the LM board.

Visus · « **Reply #470 on:** March 22, 2014, 09:28:50 PM »

cen tech 5 dollar harbor freight unit with a coupon I got it for 3 bucks lol..
I read it has 1m Ir was wondering if put a resistor in series with it would it be more accurate so I tested it with a 1m resistor in series with it --it did slow the drop but still dropping but at a snails pace rather than rabbits pace..

Thanks for correction/enlightment on that. I was like no- no way your making welds @those low v's but a longer duration yada yada posted in this thread makes it make sense.

p_devil · « **Reply #471 on:** March 30, 2014, 03:28:30 PM »

Thank You everyone for the wealth of knowledge!! A special thx to breaktru for putting all this together and getting me on this forum!!!

Now I can finally see all the great detailed pictures which makes everything so much easier. I made my first barbarian welder with only the information I could see as a guest!!

Breaktru · « **Reply #472 on:** March 30, 2014, 03:49:00 PM »

Welcome to the forum p_devil

p_devil · « **Reply #473 on:** March 30, 2014, 04:04:29 PM »

Thx again Breaktru for all the assistance getting me on here!!

p_devil · « **Reply #474 on:** March 30, 2014, 04:37:20 PM »

unmarked capacitors:

I used a dmm with max CAP 100uf to test discharged capacitors. marked 80uf tested 81-82uf. unmarked off aaa board tested tested 100-102uf. unmarked off aa board tested OL. over load. The size of the unmarked capacitor off aa board is same as a marked 120uf capacitor. My dmm doesn't test that high. I'm assuming the next size up from 100uf is 120uf. But I'm sure its over 102uf!!

p_devil · « **Reply #475 on:** April 01, 2014, 01:17:09 AM »

This is my first build using what ever I could find for cheap.

Works great!!! Thx breaktru!!!

Breaktru · « **Reply #476 on:** April 01, 2014, 07:49:17 AM »

Quote from: p_devil on April 01, 2014, 01:17:09 AM

This is my first build using what ever I could find for cheap.

Works great!!! Thx breaktru!!

Congrats

michamer · « **Reply #477 on:** April 13, 2014, 08:52:16 AM »

Quote from: p_devil on April 01, 2014, 01:17:09 AM

This is my first build using what ever I could find for cheap.

Works great!!! Thx breaktru!!!

Nifty enclosure.

Farnak · « **Reply #478 on:** May 03, 2014, 08:30:38 AM »

Electronics Goldmine has strobe boards 10 for $5 again. Sale ends 5/6/14 http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G17610B

DRA · « **Reply #479 on:** May 03, 2014, 09:01:33 AM »

Quote from: Farnak on May 03, 2014, 08:30:38 AM

Electronics Goldmine has strobe boards 10 for $5 again. Sale ends 5/6/14 http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G17610B

Thanks

sk80matic · « **Reply #480 on:** May 06, 2014, 10:27:53 PM »

I just finished my first build. It was quite a fun project and I feel pretty accomplished now that it is done. I don't really have anything new to contribute as I basically copied Breaktru's schematics and instructions. I did add two AA batteries in parallel instead of just one, and it makes a huge difference in charge time compared to the single AAA that I was playing with before.

Hopefully I can get some decent welds out of this thing.

Thanks Breaktru and everyone!

I'll add some pics when my post count is high enough to.

sk80matic · « **Reply #481 on:** May 06, 2014, 10:29:27 PM »

sk80matic · « **Reply #482 on:** May 06, 2014, 10:35:13 PM »

Pics as promised.
Enjoy!

p_devil · « **Reply #483 on:** May 06, 2014, 10:54:38 PM »

AWESOME!!

Breaktru · « **Reply #484 on:** May 07, 2014, 06:44:04 AM »

Quote from: sk80matic on May 06, 2014, 10:27:53 PM

I just finished my first build. It was quite a fun project and I feel pretty accomplished now that it is done. I don't really have anything new to contribute as I basically copied Breaktru's schematics and instructions. I did add two AA batteries in parallel instead of just one, and it makes a huge difference in charge time compared to the single AAA that I was playing with before.

Hopefully I can get some decent welds out of this thing.

Thanks Breaktru and everyone!

Great, glad my schematic helped you. Nice work

d_walk · « **Reply #485 on:** May 09, 2014, 09:33:34 AM »

Very neat wiring and layout sk80matic.
Good job

p_devil · « **Reply #486 on:** June 19, 2014, 06:16:58 PM »

hi breaktru!!!

I need help!!!

I'm welding 28awg kanthal to 32awg nickel. The welds are good but as you said after the weld it becomes weak and thinner. Sometimes it holds up to the twisting coils most of the time not. Thats with the over lap method. The butt weld method are you tapping end to end together? What if it welds on first try? I'm still getting breaks after the weld. the NR wire becomes thinner after the joint.

Thx in advance!!!

Breaktru · « **Reply #487 on:** June 19, 2014, 07:42:35 PM »

Quote from: p_devil on June 19, 2014, 06:16:58 PM

hi breaktru!!!

I need help!!!

I'm welding 28awg kanthal to 32awg nickel. The welds are good but as you said after the weld it becomes weak and thinner. Sometimes it holds up to the twisting coils most of the time not. Thats with the over lap method. The butt weld method are you tapping end to end together? What if it welds on first try? I'm still getting breaks after the weld. the NR wire becomes thinner after the joint.

Thx in advance!!!

Yes I'm tapping the ends together. I never got it to weld on the first tap. It always took 3 taps which supplied a nice wide weld surface.
When you said "I'm still getting breaks after the weld" are you referring to the tap method too?

p_devil · « **Reply #488 on:** June 20, 2014, 12:30:25 AM »

Yes. sometimes its welds on the first try but very weak weld. I'm experimenting with lower voltage and i"ll post back with results!!! It could be the nr wire is too thin. I'm going to strip some electrical wire and try different gauges.

Thx again!!! The sparkomatic works perfect.

Breaktru · « **Reply #489 on:** June 20, 2014, 09:31:35 AM »

Yes, That would have been my next 2 suggestions.

1. Try a strand of wire similar in diameter as your Kanthal
2. Dial down the voltage a tad

Madyicstik · « **Reply #490 on:** July 23, 2014, 11:17:00 AM »

Just wondering if this can be used to weld tabs on batteries?

?

CraigHB · « **Reply #491 on:** July 23, 2014, 04:19:48 PM »

Negative, you need a lot more power for that. You can make a capacitive spot welder good for battery tabs with a couple large capacitors like the ones used for high power car stereo systems. Google it and you'll find some how-to articles.

Mev · « **Reply #492 on:** September 10, 2014, 09:27:34 PM »

Haven't been on for a while, this thread as become a monster.

modfo · « **Reply #493 on:** October 14, 2014, 03:46:16 PM »

I hope I'm not breaking someone's conversation but I've been watching this post for ever and I have only been vaping 7 signed up cause I could see all the photos ! I'm so interested in the build I even went and got all the parts and ready I'm just dont know if I'm in going too get it right I even went too are local mentilsons they have all kinds of caps. Of any kind but didn't no if I had too use the photo ones they is thousands of things that you guys have been using in the photos is there from 2cents too 50cents! You are amazing I just need little help if you could too help a old man save alitte money

Breaktru · « **Reply #494 on:** October 14, 2014, 06:46:49 PM »

Hi modfo and welcome to the forum.
What do you need help with?
The caps for the flash camera welder should be rated at 330 volts and 340uF total capacitance. Although I only weld at 75v, the flash circuit is capable of putting out over 300 volts.

If you look at the original (1st) post, there are links to postings that will answer most of you questions as well as links to where you can buy caps and components.

Building the Spark-O-Matic is relatively easy if building the basic model. But building the Ohms/Volt version requires a bit more skill and knowledge.

modfo · « **Reply #495 on:** October 14, 2014, 07:06:49 PM »

Thanks this now is my second post I think you guys have a three post limit before I can post pictures but I have runs of stuff from are local electronics store they have many caps but thanks for your reply it mean alot coming from you as I have went too alot of vapes shops around here and they act like you its a waste of time but too build coils right you need one I got mods and mod boxes but I would love too rebuild the nautilus mini coil I have done some of them but not with the leads and think it would be alot better vaper with the with it I did one with the Japanese cottons in the coil it a beast it came apart in three pieces the coil then the the filler but it took me three times too get it right I just was looking and the Kodak the only thing is the charger leads my Kodak looks little different than the one in the picture and by the way my sister in law work and is the manger at Walgreens and she hooked me up with about 20 of the kodaks there is three wire from the flash . I am looking at and wondering where the charge bottom would go o got all the rest going just need that and I'm setup

modfo · « **Reply #496 on:** October 14, 2014, 07:12:43 PM »

Om working on the the cross over jumper wire its takes some skill too do that! Lol

wa9w00d · « **Reply #497 on:** November 03, 2014, 04:22:25 PM »

Hi guys, got some Kodak boards from electronic goldmine (nine of ten were functional), gonna make a spark-o-matic. I started pulling unneeded parts, and there isn’t much left on the board now (a transformer, a transistor, a resistor, a diode, and of course the cap). I think it charges faster now. Got plenty left to do, but everybody likes pictures, and I need to test my ability to post them. These will be loaded as attachments. not sure if they will show inline

And to show I can edit, yes, they do show inline!

jonas44 · « **Reply #498 on:** November 03, 2014, 05:22:36 PM »

Nice. will be watching

wa9w00d · « **Reply #499 on:** November 05, 2014, 03:59:01 PM »

Power board and panel meter tested, now just got to mount in a box with a few switches and terminal posts.